Give it to me straight

[blockerdave]

no, it invalidates it massively, even if you play on legend but you're using the bowling assistance, because you can easily hit "perfect" on both dials but you can't ever get better because you're not looking at the bowler so how do you know how to time the inputs? i use the audio assistance because at least you're watching the bowler and begin to learn when to jump etc. and i have actually improved on that. i can bowl without the assistance and i time it fine, when i first went away from HUD to no assistance (pre-patch 2 audio only worked on rookie and amateur) i had no idea of timing was delivering no-balls circa 80% of the time.

it invalidates it because someone saying "bowling is wonderful i bowl to a plan and get 7 edges an innings" but they're using the HUD to get 99.99% of deliveries perfect is so far away from my experience of the game that we may as well be talking about different games.

fact is, i can bowl back of a length on a tight line and restrict the scoring and even get more edges than i used to, but i want to bowl differently with different bowlers, getting full swinging balls and generate edges off drives and prods etc. but i find anything I bowl on a good/full length is slogged, blocked or occasionally missed by a mile with no respect to the line, the field or quality of the ball. bowling the same delivery, time after time regardless of the actual qualities of the bowler (e.g. bowling with a Vince van der Bijl I'm happy to be bowling back of a length and banging it in, bowling with Bart King I want to be bowling full swingers and cutters) is as I say, pretty dull and time after time i find myself bowling 5-10 overs then simming.

 

[Chief]

Trouble with a lot of this talk about batting vs bowling is that the game has to know what a good ball/bad ball is, and what a good shot/bad shot is. Which is an *incredibly* complicated thing. Add to this the fact that, for human players, the game must also know what you were *trying* to do, before it can know whether you are doing it well or not.

Very complex business.

 

[ellgieff]

no, it invalidates it massively, even if you play on legend but you're using the bowling assistance, because you can easily hit "perfect" on both dials but you can't ever get better because you're not looking at the bowler so how do you know how to time the inputs? i use the audio assistance because at least you're watching the bowler and begin to learn when to jump etc. and i have actually improved on that. i can bowl without the assistance and i time it fine, when i first went away from HUD to no assistance (pre-patch 2 audio only worked on rookie and amateur) i had no idea of timing was delivering no-balls circa 80% of the time.

it invalidates it because someone saying "bowling is wonderful i bowl to a plan and get 7 edges an innings" but they're using the HUD to get 99.99% of deliveries perfect is so far away from my experience of the game that we may as well be talking about different games.

fact is, i can bowl back of a length on a tight line and restrict the scoring and even get more edges than i used to, but i want to bowl differently with different bowlers, getting full swinging balls and generate edges off drives and prods etc. but i find anything I bowl on a good/full length is slogged, blocked or occasionally missed by a mile with no respect to the line, the field or quality of the ball. bowling the same delivery, time after time regardless of the actual qualities of the bowler (e.g. bowling with a Vince van der Bijl I'm happy to be bowling back of a length and banging it in, bowling with Bart King I want to be bowling full swingers and cutters) is as I say, pretty dull and time after time i find myself bowling 5-10 overs then simming.

Seriously, it's the same difference. You're still timing it based on a meter - it's just that the meter is an animation of a figure, instead of a sweeping arm.

I don't get anything like perfect, even using the hud, since it's gone up to veteran (and legend when playing internationals). And I really wasn't saying anything except "I agree with you with respect to how enjoyable bowling is" - as I said, I sometimes feel like I've earned a wicket (three full-ish off-breaks and then a slower one drawing an uppish shot, for example), but I'm not actually convinced that it really works like that.

 

[blockerdave]

yes, you're timing based on a metre, but - if it's visual, it is infinitely easier, and if you're looking there you're not looking at the bowler and you can't "improve" to switch off the HUD. finally, you have the feedback every time so you know exactly what went wrong. it's such a different experience it's nonsensical to compare the two, which is why i asked for the opinion of people who are playing like i am.

i am not trying to act superior, saying my way is better etc (though it is) but i have played both ways and know that they are just entirely different experiences.

 

[douglas93]

Much as I actually do like this game a lot, I am struggling to find the enjoyment. It just seems to me that batting is so so hard and the odds are completely stacked against you. I just cannot work out in the .whatever of a second where the ball is going from a fast bowler. I am only playing tests on pro at the minute but seem to keep getting out, main culprit probably LBW, Im a bit better with spin after patch 2 but you know theres an edge coming somewhere. Against the quicks like a few people on here I am just premeditating on the front foot just to get some runs down leg but its only a matter of time before the dreaded miss and LBW/bowled. Maybe its my own reaction times but I am struggling to compete, bit better playing county sides on pro but good bowling sides @ international batting in a test? lucky to make tea. I love the fact its a challenge but now im becoming exasperated with it, I wonder how many people have tossed it to one side because they just cant be bothered to invest the time? If people out there can bat all day on pro or more in a test I take my hat off to you, would love some advice. I am just trying out batsman (close) camera, maybe just maybe one day I might even declare an innings, imagine that.

 

[blockerdave]

i think it's subjective. i find batting hard but enjoyably so - i believe i'm getting better. i'd like more feedback for when i go wrong, and the AI field settings do spoil the enjoyment, but overall i like the experience. bowling i don't enjoy at all, but i'm sure some people must and hopefully they don't all use the HUD and can pass on some advice

 

[PotsnPans]

i think it's subjective. i find batting hard but enjoyably so - i believe i'm getting better. i'd like more feedback for when i go wrong, and the AI field settings do spoil the enjoyment, but overall i like the experience. bowling i don't enjoy at all, but i'm sure some people must and hopefully they don't all use the HUD and can pass on some advice

I'm pretty much the same. I enjoy batting a lot but am not overly struck with the bowling. Whenever the captain throws me the ball in career mode I always sigh a little bit and roll my eyes. I love the batting because although it is difficult once you truly get it then it's very rewarding. It can't be stated enough how important the addition of the practice nets has been to the career mode. Whenever I've struggled against a particular delivery or line or bowling type I just go in the net and work on it. I'm finding it much easier to read each delivery and prepare fully for timing the ball accurately. There is also something to be said for how unforgiving the game is...by which I mean I like that. Even though it's a game I like that if you make a mistake you're pretty much done...like real cricket.

 

[blockerdave]

I'm pretty much the same. I enjoy batting a lot but am not overly struck with the bowling. Whenever the captain throws me the ball in career mode I always sigh a little bit and roll my eyes. I love the batting because although it is difficult once you truly get it then it's very rewarding. It can't be stated enough how important the addition of the practice nets has been to the career mode. Whenever I've struggled against a particular delivery or line or bowling type I just go in the net and work on it. I'm finding it much easier to read each delivery and prepare fully for timing the ball accurately. There is also something to be said for how unforgiving the game is...by which I mean I like that. Even though it's a game I like that if you make a mistake you're pretty much done...like real cricket.

career is generally the only time i don't mind bowling, because i know it'll be a few overs and that's it. it's when i'm faced with bowling 100+ overs to try and get all 10 wickets i just give up and sim after a few.

 

[inertSpark]

I think to turn the bowling argument around a bit...

When you are bowling in real life, are you not in effect using a timing meter anyway? A natural meter, granted, but one nontheless. You are judging the mechanics of your action based on your position, speed, and just plain how it feels. You simply can not replicate how it feels to bowl in a video game, so for this reason, I actually feel as though the meter systems in this game is completely viable. If you were to fixate upon the fact that there is a meter on screen then by all means call it out for being an aid, but that does not by default make it a bad thing. By all means turn off all the aids, but that means you then have less feedback than bowling in real life. Just because something is harder it does not make it better, and the bowling options in this game proves that.

 

[Chief]

I think the visual aids should be available, but they should be tied into the bowler somehow, rather than way over to the left of the screen. Needs to somehow be tied into the animation, or maybe around the ball itself.

Could be two inputs (as per already), the first around the feet (maybe a bowler's mark on the ground?) and then one around the ball/hand/arm to indicate release timing maybe.

 

[douglas93]

I'm pretty much the same. I enjoy batting a lot but am not overly struck with the bowling. Whenever the captain throws me the ball in career mode I always sigh a little bit and roll my eyes. I love the batting because although it is difficult once you truly get it then it's very rewarding. It can't be stated enough how important the addition of the practice nets has been to the career mode. Whenever I've struggled against a particular delivery or line or bowling type I just go in the net and work on it. I'm finding it much easier to read each delivery and prepare fully for timing the ball accurately. There is also something to be said for how unforgiving the game is...by which I mean I like that. Even though it's a game I like that if you make a mistake you're pretty much done...like real cricket.

So in spending time in the nets are you better against quick bowlers? my issue isnt one of skill I think, I just dont have the reaction time to hit back, Im now lapsing into defensive mode and playing the straight bat against them because its my best chance of not losing a wicket.

 

[PotsnPans]

So in spending time in the nets are you better against quick bowlers? my issue isnt one of skill I think, I just dont have the reaction time to hit back, Im now lapsing into defensive mode and playing the straight bat against them because its my best chance of not losing a wicket.

Well it's definitely harder to judge out of the bowler's hand than it is from the bowling machine. But with the constant feedback on each shot selection I've found the nets has widened the range of shots I can employ to each ball. I'm finding I've actually got fractionally more time to play than I first realised and all I'm watching for are indications of line. I'm almost unconcerned if the ball is full, good or short in length because my shot range essentially stays the same. It's line where I really differ. I'm also looking to leave the ball a lot more.

 

[blockerdave]

I think to turn the bowling argument around a bit...

When you are bowling in real life, are you not in effect using a timing meter anyway? A natural meter, granted, but one nontheless. You are judging the mechanics of your action based on your position, speed, and just plain how it feels. You simply can not replicate how it feels to bowl in a video game, so for this reason, I actually feel as though the meter systems in this game is completely viable. If you were to fixate upon the fact that there is a meter on screen then by all means call it out for being an aid, but that does not by default make it a bad thing. By all means turn off all the aids, but that means you then have less feedback than bowling in real life. Just because something is harder it does not make it better, and the bowling options in this game proves that.

nope. you'd be using proprioception to understand where your body is in space. not the same.

also, i am not complaining about people using the aid, i am just saying, having played with and without it, the two experiences are very very different. i don't want to play with the aid, not because i particularly think it's cheating but because i don't want to be looking at the left hand side of the screen, i'd rather watch the bowler and learn from that when i should be providing the inputs and moving towards playing without it. playing with the HUD on does not prepare you to get better. it's a very poorly designed UI, that seems like it was just tacked on late in the day - if there were small dials above the bowler, and watching them you were watching the bowler and learning, i'd probably play with them.

all i am saying is, i just wanted some advice from someone who bowls without the HUD, because they have a similar playing experience to me. anyone bowling with the HUD doesn't have a similar experience.

 

[zimrahil]

Hey, these off topic cricket posts will be deleted soon if we don't get back to thread topic of snooker

 

[Biggs]

*Bans Zimrahil*