India's Tour of South Africa Dec 21 - Jan 22

[NILAYSHAH60]

One down should be Rohit, like what he used to do with Mumbai Indians.

He should better retire than moving to no.4. It's just wishful thinking to expect Rohit to perform at that position. It's just sheer desperation to move Rohit Sharma from the opener's spot. We tried it in the WT20 against NZ and saw the result.

 

[Bevab]

Indian white ball cricket is exactly where it was in red ball cricket when Dhoni handed over to Kohli.

All the ingredients are ready but the team badly needs a new direction and a sort of culture shock. We badly need a leader who's going to come out and say "right, I don't care how who plays, but this is how we will play."

We are playing really safe right now and it reflects in our selection. We need to give people like Deepak Chahar, Ravi Bishnoi a go. Venky Iyer being picked on the basis of 7 IPL games is a disgrace to the India cap and a high level joke. I've not seen much of Venky and he might be a great cricketer in waiting but his rise is a joke. Shreyas Iyer playing ahead of SKY is another joke. Ashwin being anywhere near a blue jersey is just a reflection of how "safe" our template has become. His fielding is awful.

Credit to Rahul today. I thought his fields were good and he didn't do much wrong!

Venkatesh Iyer was selected because

• His role as a middle-order hitter and a pace all-rounder is something that is highly overvalued in this Indian setup (as evidenced by the previous selection of Vijay Shankar and Shivam Dube).
• He was the fifth highest run scorer in the most recent VHT and did an adequate job with the ball too. His impact with the bat was terrific. Most number of sixes at an incredibly high strike-rate batting at six/five is something that is rare in our setup.
• Oh and he also happened to be high quality in those few IPL games that he played. Picking someone on the basis of one season is slightly absurd but when someone clearly appears to be good for that level and is a bloke whose qualities are sorely missing in the national playing XI?

Out of these, the only thing that appears to me as a 'disgrace' is perhaps the first point and the Indian side would far from be the first to attempt such stunts when the depth is questionable in one department.

Interestingly, the best pace all-rounder in VHT was one Rishi Dhawan (remember him?) who is second on both the runs scored and wickets taken columns. He also happened to captain the title winning side who were the underdogs throughout the tournament. He has played previously for India with underwhelming performances but if he does impress in the upcoming IPL... do not be surprised to see the next 'shocking' call-up.

Also, I know that you're a massive KL Rahul fan but you credit him after the manner of the defeat today and his performance? His choice to selfishly open again after having clearly done better at number five in complete opposition to the most recent lineups we've played with our first choice opener currently injured whilst we bench the IPL and VHT's top scorer who has impressed at every level of domestic cricket in his ideal format and happens to be an opener is the real disgrace.

 

[Bevab]

He should better retire than moving to no.4. It's just wishful thinking to expect Rohit to perform at that position. It's just sheer desperation to move Rohit Sharma from the opener's spot. We tried it in the WT20 against NZ and saw the result.

Yeah I don't get this clamour for Rohit to move down the order a la MS Dhoni once he became captain. Sharma ji was the second best ODI batsman in the last ODI cycle, the most impressive batsman IMO at the last WC, the best ODI opener of the previous decade and also has finally been appointed captain in a high pressure role amidst much scrutiny, media profile and controversy. Let him open and play his natural game with those additional tweaks that had him scoring faster than usual in the previous WC.

 

[Bevab]

None. Kohli and Rohit have to do that job!

I don't agree with this at all. Nearly every other ODI side plays two all-rounders at the least, even if it comes at the expense of their batting depth. If need be, it is far more imperative that we strengthen our batting depth with bowling all-rounders who are slightly less impressive with the ball in comparison to pure number elevens than go in expecting 50 overs from five bowlers alone. My ideal XI would include a fit again Hardik who can still bowl fast-medium at the least and Jadeja but if that is too fanciful, we need to get Shreyas or SKY capable of bowling at least five overs.

 

[Bevab]

Given everything that has been happening in and around South African cricket especially with their head coach in the thick of it, Bavuma and Elgar have to been given incredible praise for the way they've marshalled their men off the field and led them on it with astute and gritty captaincy. To see them so united in the dressing room amidst all of the controversies around them gives me real hope that someday soon we will have a truly representative South African side out there that gets their much deserved trophy.

 

[SaiSrini]

He should better retire than moving to no.4. It's just wishful thinking to expect Rohit to perform at that position. It's just sheer desperation to move Rohit Sharma from the opener's spot. We tried it in the WT20 against NZ and saw the result.

India's limited overs mess (something that we got ourselves into, for the past 3-4 years) means that we've to look at "out of the box" options. Sachin played at a time when India had a splurge of riches for the middle order department (Yuvraj, Dhoni, Raina, Dravid, etc.) and so Sachin was basically able to command that he bats at the top. Right now, Rohit is not in that position where he can command the opening spot.

India has put itself into a situation where all they are producing are "Powerplay batsmen" who are great at taking advantage of the field restrictions, but their game changes drastically when the field restrictions are removed. And as a result, the cut throat competition for the opening spots. Our limited overs setup is truly in SHAMBLES right now and has been like this since before the 2019 WC, and nothing has changed.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Right now, Rohit is not in that position where he can command the opening spot.

Are you serious? Rohit's SR is close to 90 since the start of 2019 and he has been in a purple patch since about 3 years now. Why do you want to move him at a position where he doesn't perform well? Rohit was a better player to bat in the middle order way back in 2013/14. He had a terrible season in 2017 & 2018 where he played in the middle order for MI. He did decently well since he has opened.

 

[LiveLoveABD]

Venkatesh Iyer was selected because

• His role as a middle-order hitter and a pace all-rounder is something that is highly overvalued in this Indian setup (as evidenced by the previous selection of Vijay Shankar and Shivam Dube).
• He was the fifth highest run scorer in the most recent VHT and did an adequate job with the ball too. His impact with the bat was terrific. Most number of sixes at an incredibly high strike-rate batting at six/five is something that is rare in our setup.
• Oh and he also happened to be high quality in those few IPL games that he played. Picking someone on the basis of one season is slightly absurd but when someone clearly appears to be good for that level and is a bloke whose qualities are sorely missing in the national playing XI?

Out of these, the only thing that appears to me as a 'disgrace' is perhaps the first point and the Indian side would far from be the first to attempt such stunts when the depth is questionable in one department.

Interestingly, the best pace all-rounder in VHT was one Rishi Dhawan (remember him?) who is second on both the runs scored and wickets taken columns. He also happened to captain the title winning side who were the underdogs throughout the tournament. He has played previously for India with underwhelming performances but if he does impress in the upcoming IPL... do not be surprised to see the next 'shocking' call-up.

Also, I know that you're a massive KL Rahul fan but you credit him after the manner of the defeat today and his performance? His choice to selfishly open again after having clearly done better at number five in complete opposition to the most recent lineups we've played with our first choice opener currently injured whilst we bench the IPL and VHT's top scorer who has impressed at every level of domestic cricket in his ideal format and happens to be an opener is the real disgrace.

Who on earth is VHT?

I don't give a toss about Rahul the captain. He is horrible but his fields today were on the money. May be it's the hangover of seeing an extra person in the ring after 7 years. Rahul has had to perform at 5 because he was put in a corner. He is by some margin the best opener we have after Rohit and Dhawan. There's no reason he should bat at 5 just because a mental captain decided he should be there. What he needs is a license to throw his bat around and the assurance that he will open at the world cup.

VHT is Vijay Hazare Trophy?

If so and I have clarified clearly that Venky might be a superb cricketer and I have genuinely not seen him but if that is the benchmark then we might as well have tried Paul Valthaty. For me, the white ball game has become a circus for clowns to come and do their gig for a season and vanish. This obsession of looking for a 6th bowling option when there isn't a proven one is absurd. It is very similar to the 5th bowler desires of the 00's when our part timers did that job and RSD kept wickets.

I believe in being proud of what we have. It's not like great cricket teams have not existed without 6 options. Give Venky one more season and then get him in? Hell even if you are playing him this series at least bowl him? Don't play him ahead of SKY and then not bowl him like they did in the first game. He did a reasonable job today but not menacing.

And yes we have started to disgrace the India cap by handing them out like sweets on the arrival of a new born. I will again pen down my tentative WC squad

Rahul
Rohit
Kohli
Sky
Pant
Jadeja
Shardul/Hardik/Iyer (if he has a gun year)
Bishnoi/Chahal (definitely giving Bishnoi a go)
Kuldeep (I heard he's been batting a lot in the nets and been hitting some really long balls)
Deepak Chahar/Shami/Bhuvi
Bumrah

Dhawan, Kishan, 2 quicks and one spinner on the bench.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Rahul
Rohit
Kohli
Sky
Pant
Jadeja
Shardul/Hardik/Iyer (if he has a gun year)
Bishnoi/Chahal (definitely giving Bishnoi a go)
Kuldeep (I heard he's been batting a lot in the nets and been hitting some really long balls)
Deepak Chahar/Shami/Bhuvi
Bumrah

I just hope you haven't kept Shreyas Iyer out on purpose.

 

[LiveLoveABD]

I just hope you haven't kept Shreyas Iyer out on purpose.

I have. In 15-16 member squads, someone will be unfortunate and he is that bloke. Kishan can open, bat in the middle and keep. Our problem is that middle order. People saying Pant needs to reign it in don't know what the hell they're talking about. I would actually give him a pat on the back for the way he got out yesterday. I don't want a sterilised, timid version of him like KL Rahul is displaying at the moment where his bank account and stature is rising but his game is suffering. We have ruined SKY and KL in these last 5-6 years. They are both at their peak and pomp and it won't last forever. Both should have played a lot for India by now.

Dhawan is a remarkable 50 over and ICC tournament player. He is like an insurance policy and god have mercy on the opposition if he hits a purple patch because he can compile big big tournaments. It's a bit like Yuvraj. Once they get on a run, they are unstoppable!

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

I have. In 15-16 member squads, someone will be unfortunate and he is that bloke. Kishan can open, bat in the middle and keep. Our problem is that middle order. People saying Pant needs to reign it in don't know what the hell they're talking about. I would actually give him a pat on the back for the way he got out yesterday. I don't want a sterilised, timid version of him like KL Rahul is displaying at the moment where his bank account and stature is rising but his game is suffering. We have ruined SKY and KL in these last 5-6 years. They are both at their peak and pomp and it won't last forever. Both should have played a lot for India by now.

Dhawan is a remarkable 50 over and ICC tournament player. He is like an insurance policy and god have mercy on the opposition if he hits a purple patch because he can compile big big tournaments. It's a bit like Yuvraj. Once they get on a run, they are unstoppable!

Don't you think that we should do away with Bhuvi if he keep bowling those 125 kph deliveries? I mean he also had a below average WT20 and seems tired even if he bowls about 3-4 overs.

 

[Bigby Wolf]

Deepak Chahar straight away on the mark.

If only Dhawan was a little bit more proactive.

 

[harishankar]

Deepak Chahar straight away on the mark.

If only Dhawan was a little bit more proactive.

Well thankfully that wasn’t too costly.

 

[harishankar]

Well the fielding has certainly picked up. Just the spark India needed.

 

[LiveLoveABD]

Don't you think that we should do away with Bhuvi if he keep bowling those 125 kph deliveries? I mean he also had a below average WT20 and seems tired even if he bowls about 3-4 overs.

The easiest thing to do in life is to do away with people. I am not in favour of doing away with Bhuvi. He is an absolute class act and he's priceless in pressure situations. Whatever he is going through is temporary and I think he will roar back to life sometime. Does that coincide with his and our World Cup ambitions? Time will tell. It's a bit like the fools shouting Kohli is done as a batter. He is a class class act. We need to back these guys in such times and instead of doing away with them the support staff needs to understand what exactly is up with them. I'm shocked there is no psychologist with the Indian team specially during Covid.

I keep saying this again and again. When we say we didn't have 'pace' bowlers it is true but we have always had a rich history of swing bowlers and we under estimate our own worth as a cricketing nation and run after things we don't have. Whether it was Prasad, Irfan Pathan, Praveen Kumar, Bhuvneshwar Kumar or now Deepak Chahar we have always had this one guy that can run through teams with the new ball with swing bowling and we have moved away from that recently because of a pace obsession. Not playing that nibbler in India, England, SA and NZ is almost criminal in my opinion.

Bumrah aside, I would really look at Deepak Chahar in all formats because he can run through teams. It is a bit like Sehwag with the bat where the guy can win you a game in half an hour and even on his off days its not like he will get belted. There is also a couple of forgotten assets in Nagarkoti and Mavi. Mavi in particular can really dart it around with the new nut and unlike a lot of his peers, he's in his natural form an in swing bowler. Most batters these days have a pronounced back and across movement and shape up to play the ball going away or one that is back of a length on off. He can add a different variation and dimension and get a lot of LBW's.

Lastly, we need two proper spinners for the middle and if Jadeja cannot pick wickets then he is good enough to bat at 6. We need two spinners which in my opinion is Kuldeep and Bishnoi. Watch out for Kuldeep the batter. I am hearing in the domestic circles that he's working very hard on his batting and hitting them clean and hard.