The abuse of Moeen Ali

[MUFC1987]

I think you're muddying the waters by essentially saying that Moeen Ali is a symbol of Pakistan. I'm sure, that rightly, Moeen Ali is very proud of his heritage, but he is British and I'm sure he'll tell you that. I appreciate that people get stick due to rivalries, as it's a part of sport, but this is more than just stick. He's been booed constantly. Not just the odd boo when his name is announced or a light hearted bit of a comedy boo when he makes a mistake, but literally everything he's done. If he'd come out at the start of the series saying how great Pakistan are and how he wants to see India do badly, then I could understand it. But this? I think it's just pathetic and small minded and there's not much anyone can do to defend it. I think it's just far too much.

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

I think you're muddying the waters by essentially saying that Moeen Ali is a symbol of Pakistan. I'm sure, that rightly, Moeen Ali is very proud of his heritage, but he is British and I'm sure he'll tell you that. I appreciate that people get stick due to rivalries, as it's a part of sport, but this is more than just stick. He's been booed constantly. Not just the odd boo when his name is announced or a light hearted bit of a comedy boo when he makes a mistake, but literally everything he's done. If he'd come out at the start of the series saying how great Pakistan are and how he wants to see India do badly, then I could understand it. But this? I think it's just pathetic and small minded and there's not much anyone can do to defend it. I think it's just far too much.

Look no one is saying he got booed because he is a Pakistani, we all know he is English. He got booed because he has a connection to India's biggest rivals Pakistan.

Also I am sorry but did you try and differentiate between the kind of boos. What the hell is a "a light hearted bit of a comedy boo" :P Does this alone not show how desperately you are clutching at straws here. Indian fans were not booing him in a comedy way, the boos were sinister !! I mean come on, thats just desperate. The art of differentiating between boos.

I mean come on, the guy has a connection to India's biggest cricketing rivals, and got stick from the fans, and its part of the banter that goes on in cricket. I can equally accuse you of muddying the waters by essentially try to imply sinister motives to par for the course stick players get on the field from the opposite fans. And I can eqaully say that this attitude of Moen Ali trying to bring in racism to what is clearly an issue that has nothing to do with racism is pathetic, and there is not much one can say to support him.

Also the fans who booed him, one would think were also british for the mst part, usually 2nd or 3rd gen living in Birmingham. Which makes the racist angle even more reduntant.

A guy is saying that people of the same race as him, and same nationality as him, racially abused him !! I mean it cannot get more lame that this.

I do agree he should not have gotten booed, in an ideal world no one will get booed, but from time to time players playing int'l cricket will get stick from the crowd. Its part of Int'l cricket.

 

[MUFC1987]

I was mentioning how the boos were constant and not just as the result of something that Moeen had done during the game. And that opening paragraph is contradictory to say the least.

He didn't get booed because he's from Pakistan, but because he has a connection to Pakistan? His connection is his race, his heritage. He is being booed because of this. How is that in any way, shape or form, acceptable?

If an Indian player comes to play County cricket and rocks up in Derby, say, and gets booed from first ball to the last, every time he touches the ball, is that acceptable? The answer is, or course not. Booing because of where a person comes from is discrimination. Something that I and a lot of other people on this forum and around the world, have a problem with.

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

I was mentioning how the boos were constant and not just as the result of something that Moeen had done during the game. And that opening paragraph is contradictory to say the least.

He didn't get booed because he's from Pakistan, but because he has a connection to Pakistan? His connection is his race, his heritage. He is being booed because of this. How is that in any way, shape or form, acceptable?

If an Indian player comes to play County cricket and rocks up in Derby, say, and gets booed from first ball to the last, every time he touches the ball, is that acceptable? The answer is, or course not. Booing because of where a person comes from is discrimination. Something that I and a lot of other people on this forum and around the world, have a problem with.

You clearly have a hard time understanding things.

Your entire post is a contradiction. When you boo Aussie players are you not doing because of their heritage? Why else are you booing them. Because they are aussies playing against england? So is the connection there not their race and nationality and heritage?

Here Moenn Ali was just booed, the kind of abusive songs you guys make up about Aussie players is frankly appalling. Is that not done merely because they are Aussies and because of their nationality and heritage, I don't see anyone complaining then.

First of all booing is not a form of racial abuse, I don't care how you extend it. Moenn Ali got booed, purely because he is playing against India, and has a connection with India's biggest cricketing rival Pakistan. The connection here is not Moen Ali's heritage, but rather India's rivarly from Pakistan. If India had no cricketing rivalry with Pakistan, then he would not be booed even with his Pakistan connection. So the booing is not coming from the hatred of his race or color, but from the cricketing rivalry India has with pakistan. So the stick he is getting is purely cricket related, and that is India-Pak rivalry in cricket. Why is it so hard for you understand this. Had this cricketing rivalry not existed, he would not get stick, even this his Pakistani heritage and all.

The reason for him being booed, is thus purely cricket related. He could have been a Hindu and had a connection with pakistan, and he would still have gotten booed. Why can't you wrap your head around this fact. India Pakistan have a rivalry and on the cricket field some fans booed him for that connection. Thus the underlying reason for him being booed, is purely the cricket rivalry connection. No one gives damn whether he is a muslim or a christian. He could have been a hindu and still been booed like I said.

Now if you cannot wrap your head around this, what can I say. Also in your example of Indian players getting booed in county cricket. Is there any cricketing reason to boo Indian players? Yes in Moenn ALi's case as I have said, the reason for him being booed, is purely cricketing. He was not booed because he has a Pakistani heritage. In isolation his Pakistani heritage is irrelevant to anyone and everyone. The reason he got booed, is because underneath all this is the cricketing rivalry that India and Pakistan share.

Why is it so hard for you to understand this simple thing, I do not know. In an ideal world yes no one should get stick, and not even Moenn Ali should have gotten booed. I agree. However, to try and misplace a booing that comes purely on cricketing ground, for racial abuse of the worst kind is just nonsense.

 

[MUFC1987]

Look, your post is going around in circles because you refuse to accept that Moeen Ali is being booed because of his heritage. Personally attacking me doesn't really do much for you either, so you can try to say that I'm not understanding things because I'm not clever enough all you like, but it's not adding to the discussion.

I would like to point out though that I've never booed an Australian and the only time that I've seen that happen (every time a player touches the ball etc - just like with Moeen) is to David Warner and we all know the reasons for that. But booing an Australian isn't a valid comparison, because that would be the same as an Indian supporter booing a Pakistani player. Moeen Ali and note how his name is spelt, is not a Pakistani player. He is an England player. So the comparison would be an England supporter booing say, Brendon Nash, who played for the West Indies, but has an Australian family. Has something like that ever happened?

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

Look, your post is going around in circles because you refuse to accept that Moeen Ali is being booed because of his heritage. Personally attacking me doesn't really do much for you either, so you can try to say that I'm not understanding things because I'm not clever enough all you like, but it's not adding to the discussion.

I would like to point out though that I've never booed an Australian and the only time that I've seen that happen (every time a player touches the ball etc - just like with Moeen) is to David Warner and we all know the reasons for that. But booing an Australian isn't a valid comparison, because that would be the same as an Indian supporter booing a Pakistani player. Moeen Ali and note how his name is spelt, is not a Pakistani player. He is an England player. So the comparison would be an England supporter booing say, Brendon Nash, who played for the West Indies, but has an Australian family. Has something like that ever happened?

Your post if going around in circles and you cannot understand that Moenn Ali is being attacked because of a pure cricketing rivalry and cricketing reasons.

Also you don;t have to tell me again and again that Moenn Ali is a English player, because we all know it. Unless you have a fondness for stating the obvious I don't know why you keep saying it. Second, Moenn Ali has a connection to Pakistan is also well known. Now in isolation this connection he has to Pakistan means nothing and he would not get booed for at all, by anyone.

So to say he is being booed because of Pakistani connections alone is just wrong.

Without that fact that India have a cricketing rivalry with Pakistan, Ali's Pakistani connection, would lead to him getting no stick at all. So the sine qua non, here is the cricketing rivalry and not his connection to Pakistan. Even with his Pakistan connection, if there was no cricketing rivalry he would not have been booed. So the booing is purely cricket related.

Thus the stick he got is purely a cricketing one. If you can understand this, then fine, of you don't you can carry on your pointless crusade, I am done trying to make you see sense here.

 

[MUFC1987]

I keep on calling him English, because you keep on calling him Pakistani. And in case you missed the article in the opening post (It's a great article, well worth reading) it's not just one person on the internet (i.e. me) that needs convincing. It's a whole world out there.

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

I keep on calling him English, because you keep on calling him Pakistani. And in case you missed the article in the opening post (It's a great article, well worth reading) it's not just one person on the internet (i.e. me) that needs convincing. It's a whole world out there.

Just read the posts again, I called him someone with a connection to Pakistan and that is not even remotely the same thing as calling him a Pakistani.

Also the "whole world" doesn't exactly need convincing on the issue. Most of it doesn't even know that there is an over-sensitive bloke desperately trying to play the victim by connecting stick he got for cricketing reasons to his islamic roots. So chill.

He should learn to take stick from the crowd, by watching someone like Jadeja at Lord's. All through the test, booed when he walked in, booed when he bowled, booed when he batted, booed when touched the ball, and yet he didn't turn around and say he is being abused for being an Indian or that it was racism. He played a swashbuckling match changing knock and then swinging his bat like a sword. That is man's reaction. Trying to play the victim, is just lame.

Ideally no one should be booed, not even Moenn Ali, but he cannot expect special treatment just because he is a muslim. Int'l cricket is tough and sometimes crowds will boo you. If Moenn Ali thought this was tough, wait till he goes to Australia.

Edit - Its obvious I kinda overstated how much Moenn Ali is to blame and effectively banging my head repeatedly talking to someone who is clearly an expert on missing the point, more often than batsmen play and miss the ball on a seaming wicket, seems to have been the reason for that. Yes I do realise its rather harsh on Moenn Ali, especially in maybe saying he is trying to play the victim.

That having been said, its still not racism, and Moenn Ali was booed purely for cricketing reasons. Those who say this is racist in some way are totally going overboard.

 

[Deleted member 9102]

Is this the 'PokerAce' guy? Seems to have joined after he got banned, and posts in the same forum sections in the same sort of manner. Seems a bit fishy.

 

[Lionden]

It's terrible, racism is intolerable.

 

[greymatter776]

I would say booing was not right.Anyway booing is insulting.If the insulting is done for something the player has done on or off field like what happened with Jadeja or Anderson its justified because the spectators has every right to respond in a good way to what is happening in the game they watch. But insulting someone for something he had not done or for any features of him like his nationality,religion or color or whatever it is,is absolutely wrong.Whether it racist or not,I am against the insulting in this case.

 

[cricketmad09]

What rubbish. All English players should be booed equally.

 

[Umair7]

What rubbish. All English players should be booed equally.

Except for Cook he is our legend

 

[IceAgeComing]

It is quite clearly motivated purely on national origin, which fits the definition of racism in the view of people who aren't idiots. Its certainly xenophobia, which we all should agree is an awful, awful thing anyway...

 

[grkrama]

Xenophobia is the unreasoned fear of that which is perceived to be foreign or strange