The10 Greatest Bowlers of all time(Relive:Dennis Lillee's 8-29 against Rest of the World XI)

robin2855

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THE 10 GREATEST TEST BOWLERS OF ALL TIME

We had pretty good response with regards to The 10 Greatest batsmen of all time.

Now time to shift gears to The 10 Greatest Bowlers of all time.

Criteria:

Minimum 200 Wickets.

Bowler type: Specialist Bowlers only.

Exception: Sidney Barnes (189 wickets in 27 tests)

Sir Gary Sobers is a genuine Allrounder (Bat & Ball both equal),Imran Khan, Kapil Dev, Sir Richard Hadlee and Sir Ian Botham are Bowling All Rounders and Jack Kallis is a Batting All Rounder and thus have not been considered.

Here?s my selection:

1. Muttiah Muralitharan (Sri Lanka)
2. Shane Warne (Australia)
3. Wasim Akram (Pakistan)
4. Glen McGraw(Australia)
5. Malcolm Marshall (West Indies)
6. Dennis Lillee (Australia)
7. Sydney Barnes (England)
8. Fred Trueman(England)
9. Courtney Walsh ,Courtney Ambrose(Both West Indies)Anil Kumble( India)
10. Michael Holding(West Indies), Abdul Kader

Let?s see what?s reader?s selection?

Good luck and Cheers!
 
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shravi

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Anil Kumble shouldn't be in the Top 10 imo. I don't know about the rest because I haven't seen them but from the bowlers I have seen, I've always thought Glen McGrath was the best. He's the fast bowling idol to me.
 

King Cricket

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1. Murali and Warne (It's tough to choose the best one between them)
2. McGrath
3. Marshall
4. Lilie
5. Akram and Hadlee
6. Barnes
7. Walsh
8. Ambrose
9. Trueman and Imran
10. Spofforth and Donald

I might have forgotten somebody.

Edit: Told you I must have forgotten somebody. It's Donald
 
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sami ullah khan

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I have not seen most of the old folks bowl so here is my list of the bowlers i have seen in action
1. Glen Mcgrath
2. Waseem Akram
3. Shane Warne
4. Deniss Lillee
5. Waqar Younis
6. Malcom Marshall
7. Courtney Walsh
8. Allan Donald
9. Muttiah MuraliDharan
10.Curtly Ambrose
As per Robins request I am replacing Imran Khan Who was At no. 7
 
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jordox

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Warne was miles better than Murali.
 

Sartaj

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i'm not sure if shane bond has 200 wickets under his belt,but he is definitely one of the greatest bowlers ever to have taken birth on holy earth.
 

King Cricket

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Warne was miles better than Murali.

Murali has taken more wickets than Warne in less number of matches. He is the only bowler to take 1000+ intl wickets. But again, Warne has played more matches against top-class opponents than Murali, he has been successful against almost all of them. He has troubled the top batters more (that's my opinion, though)- you just can't say who's the best between them. It's 50-50.

King Cricket added 1 Minutes and 4 Seconds later...

i'm not sure if shane bond has 200 wickets under his belt,but he is definitely one of the greatest bowlers ever to have taken birth on holy earth.

If only he played some more tests.....
 

Howsie

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A good bowler can win a game of cricket for you almost on his own. If a great bowler is having a great day, he can rip through the oppositions batting line and set up an easy victory for his team. There have been many great bowlers over the years, here I try and condense it down into the top ten.

10. Wasim Akram (PAK) - A fast left-handed bowler, the "Sultan of Swing" took over 400 Test wickets, and holds the record for amount of wickets in ODIs (502) and List A cricket (881). An average of 23.62 in Test matches from 104 appearances is an impressive one. He is only one of three bowlers to record two hat-tricks in Test cricket, and only one of three to have achieved the same feat in ODI cricket.

9. Courtney Walsh (WIN) - Bowling over 5,000 Test match overs and taking over 500 Test match wickets, Walsh was a fast right-handed bowler. His partnership with Curtly Ambrose was one of the most feared in cricket throughout the 90s, carrying on the reputation left behind by previous West Indies fast bowlers.

8. Glenn McGrath (AUS) - McGrath was a key reason for Australia's domination of cricket since the mid 90s. His 563 Test wickets is the most any fast bowler has ever got, and fourth in the all time list. He has also taken more World Cup wickets than any other player. His average of 21.64 from 124 Tests is one of the best you will find on this star-studded list.

7. Curtly Ambrose (WIN) - This 6'7" colossus bowled over 1,000 maiden overs in just 98 Tests, and took 405 wickets. As already mentioned, his partnership with Courtney Walsh was a feared one, and his average of just 20.99 shows why that was so. His 2 metre plus frame was an intimidating sight for any batsman, and allowed him to get bounce on whatever pitch he played on.

6. Dennis Lillee (AUS) - Very unlucky to miss out on the top five, Lillee was a fearsome fast bowler with a fiery temper. His 355 Test wickets was a record when he retired in 1984, and his average of 23.92 isn't too shabby either. Few, if any batsmen ever looked forward to facing Lillee, as they knew they would be in for a tough time.

5. Sir Richard Hadlee (NZ) - Hadlee was the first bowler to ever pass the 400 Test wickets mark. It was often said that Hadlee always thought 'what would Lillee do?' when trying to get his man out. The Kiwi went on to eclipse his idol with 431 Test wickets and an average of just 22.29.

4. Malcolm Marshall (WIN) - Marshall's Test bowling average of 20.94 is the best of any bowler to have taken more then 200 wickets. His aggressive fast bowling became feared among batsmen, especially his bouncer, which people attempted to get banned on more than one occasion. He recorded 376 Test match wickets.

3. Shane Warne (AUS) - The third and final Aussie to be featured on this list, Shane Warne is the greatest leg-spin bowler in cricket history. One of only two men to have achieved over 700 Test match wickets, he was the only bowler to be voted as one of the five Wisden Cricketers of the Century. He is popular to a huge amount of fans around the world, but because of his outspoken personality is unpopular among many more.

2. Sydney Barnes (ENG) - The first Englishman on this list, and perhaps a surprise choice. Despite not taking too many wickets, Barnes' Test match average remains the best I've seen. He only played in 27 Test matches and took 189 wickets. That's an average of a phenomenal 16.43. His first-class career was more of the same, with an average of just over 17, recording 719 wickets in 133 matches.

1. Muttiah Muralitharan (SRI) - Murali is without doubt the greatest off-spinner of all time, and, according to me, the greatest bowler of all time. In an unspectacular Sri Lankan side he has taken 770 wickets in Test matches, which is more than anyone else. His highest average in all forms of the game is 22.74, in ODI, and he has a 19.26 average in first-class, having recorded well over 1,000 wickets. He is second in the list of all time ODI wicket takers. His most potent weapon is perhaps his infamous doosra, which no-one has been able to master like he has done.
 

King Cricket

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^ Yeah, right. Warne has taken 1001 intl wickets in his whole career. Didn't know it. But still no of intl wickets taken by Murali > that of Warne
 

manee

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1. Sydney Barnes
2. Malcolm Marshall
3. Dennis Lillee
4. Muttiah Muralitharan
5. Shane Warne
6. Glenn Mcgrath
7. Allan Donald
8. Sir Richard Hadlee
9. Curtly Ambrose
10. Fred Trueman
 

Howsie

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Shane Warne and Muttiah Muralitharan are unarguably the two greatest spinners of the modern era if not the two greatest in cricket history.

Warne, a leg spinner, who spun the ball miles, and who always had the aura that batsmen were out even before facing him.

He excelled first with his flipper, but after a finger injury he gave the flipper up. Instead he developed a variety of straight balls with clever changes of flight, pace, over spin and side spin.

He developed the slider and a zooter (former a over spun straight ball and the latter a back spun straight ball), and took many wickets with it. He was never really a good exponent of the googly, because of his grip. Very good born leader was he, and a thinker, planning dismissals of many batsmen.

Muralitharan, bowls unorthodox wrist spun off breaks, is also a big turner, and easily the biggest spinner ever when it comes to finger spin - or off break bowlers.

In his early years he relied on change of flight and pace and the big of breaks to get wickets for him. In the dawn of the 2000's, Muralitharan, developed a straight ball, or a top spinner, and by 2003 he developed a doosra, or the off spinners wrong'un / googly.

That's when his effectiveness increased, and he became the leading bowler of the world surpassing Warne. Currently he is in the process of developing a flipper, or a back spun off break.

How do we compare these two?

Best method will be to let them bowl against a set of batsmen with same support bowlers and fielders. This is not a possible option, and some other method must be developed using current data.

Comparing bowlers across eras is difficult because the game is changing. But for a players who have played in same era can be compared with their stats.

Comparing stats is a tricky subject, because if you torture the stats enough, they will confess to you. What ever the method used should be used with sound reasons to back up the claim.

The comparison

Muralitharan is unfairly accused of playing more against Bangladesh and Zimbabwe. But on other hand Warne has played more against England who were poor against spin. To iron out these differences a method is needed to make all the parameters for the bowlers similar.

The main point is that bowlers should be tested in similar conditions. Sri Lankan and Australian conditions differ so much and all home games for these two players can be disregarded.

For the conditions to be fair, the same set of batsmen should be facing. Hence Murali's matches against Australia and Warne's matches against SL cannot be used to compare, although this could be added to make it complete.

The next hurdle is that Warne and Murali has played different number of matches against different oppositions, and sent different number of deliveries as well.

In this comparison, we have to allow both of them the same number of deliveries against each opposition.

The second approach is to allow each bowlers the same proportions of deliveries against each opposition. Since the number of deliveries against SL by Warne and that of Murali against AUS is a fixed number.

I adopted the second method. Since Warne has sent more deliveries than Murali his stats are taken as the base values.

Warne has sent down 21288 deliveries against all test teams away from home. He has bowled 14% of them against India and 12.8% of them against New Zealand.

This calculation does not include Sri Lanka as there is no common conditions applied for Murali. Murali has bowled 18067 against all test teams, and 16495 of them excluding Australia.

The standardization will give a share of 2305 deliveries against India for Murali (14% x 16495).

The strike rates and economy rates were used to calculate the number of wickets Murali will take, and runs that he'll concede during the number of deliveries against each other. Later the composite Average, Strike rate and economy rate were calculated. The following table shows the standardization process.

How do you upload Excel files because it keeps saying there is an error, and it's only 68 kb. :(

Anyway


When looking at the overall results Warne has a better SR and a better Avg than Murali. But these include matches played against AUS and SL which involves different conditions and different batsmen.

If we did have data of how Murali would do against same the SL line up in AUS conditions, and Warne's performance against an Aussie line up in SL, we could have included them.

Only oppositions that both Warne and Murali played against should be considered. When common oppositions are taken in to account, Muralitharan has a better Average (23.2 vs 24.9), better Strike rate (55.1 vs 56.0) and better Economy (2.5 vs 2.7).

This proves beyond doubt that Murali has not been helped much by playing against weaker teams.

In fact had he been presented with the similar conditions as Warne, his stats would be far better. Considering Murali as the greatest spinner ever is very much helped by these stats
 

robin2855

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Excellent Selections by Everyone. Watch out for Criteria - All Rounders

Congrats to Everyone for A PLUS Selections.

However a word of caution - Some of you have included All rounders in the list.

You cannot do that.

Please read the criteria carefully.

I am reiterating that for your kind attention.

Criteria:

All Rounders cannot be considered . We are only talking about Specialist Bowlers.

This rationale is valid for everyone including myself.

So those who have included Imran, Sir Ricahrd Hadlee are kindly requested to replace them with a Specialist bowler as them deem appropriate.

I promise to everyone I will soon have a Thread on the Allrounder category - possibly this weekend.

Hope this helps.

Cheers!
 

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