DRAFT! Ashes history...

[Samuels]

I was just wondering Sifter that for the draft members, we should not be allowed to vote for our own team but choose another member's team that we like the most. Just like how cricket icon did

Isn't that obvious? Anyway, I do not feel the need to pick a twelfth man but since I can afford the luxury, I pick Billy Barnes. A perfect replacement for Johnny Briggs on a seaming wicket. He can bat too and that better than Briggs and can boast of a great bowling record at the same time.

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12th man would have to be Gary Pratt

Ain't I not jealous? Gary Pratt: the best 12th man ever!

 

[Aalay]

Isn't that obvious?

Hah! My bad, lol.

 

[cricket_icon]

Isn't that obvious? Anyway, I do not feel the need to pick a twelfth man but since I can afford the luxury, I pick Billy Barnes. A perfect replacement for Johnny Briggs on a seaming wicket. He can bat too and that better than Briggs and can boast of a great bowling record at the same time.

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Ain't I not jealous? Gary Pratt: the best 12th man ever!

hahahahaa yeah

 

[Samuels]

hahahahaa yeah

Shame Ponting was in KrishnamurthiN's now forfeited team.

 

[cricket_icon]

I might just add Steve Harmison as a 12th man lol I know he wasn't at all consistent against Aus and was hammered more often than not but he had the odd exceptional spell, the 5 wickets at Lords or the spell of 4 at Perth I think it was. Good replacement if any of my first line pacemen are injured

 

[sifter132]

I cast a vote for Samuels (not myself ), think he's got the best Ashes side

 

[Sulaiman7]

I'll have to admit it , Aalay has the best team.

 

[Samuels]

I'll have to admit it , Aalay has the best team.

I beg to differ at that. Yes he has all the star players but as far as Ashes is concerned, only KP, Warne and Chappell has been consistent. Botham, barring one series was average while Harris has played too less matches to be ranked amongst the best. Jimmy Anderson is not the best of Ashes bowler. Larwood is known for the bodyline series but still he was just above average in Ashes in terms of picking wickets at regular intervals which is for the job of a bowler. Ames was legendary but not in Ashes with an average of 27. Waugh and Langer are other good players but do they make their side the best one? The answer is no I guess. Everything said, his team was second best team overall for me but that considering the players on their top form. For me, the batting of Fenil's and Cricket_icon's team was the best. Bowling has to be of my team and Umair2000's. A special mention for War who made the best possible not so popular XI.

 

[Sulaiman7]

I beg to differ at that. Yes he has all the star players but as far as Ashes is concerned, only KP, Warne and Chappell has been consistent. Botham, barring one series was average while Harris has played too less matches to be ranked amongst the best. Jimmy Anderson is not the best of Ashes bowler. Larwood is known for the bodyline series but still he was just above average in Ashes in terms of picking wickets at regular intervals which is for the job of a bowler. Ames was legendary but not in Ashes with an average of 27. Waugh and Langer are other good players but do they make their side the best one? The answer is no I guess. Everything said, his team was second best team overall for me but that considering the players on their top form. For me, the batting of Fenil's and Cricket_icon's team was the best. Bowling has to be of my team and Umair2000's. A special mention for War who made the best possible not so popular XI.

What about my team? Talking about the Ashes , I should be having the best bowling.

I want some people to analyze on my team (it includes you too , Samuels).

 

[sifter132]

I'll have a go First, your bowling can't be the best bowling attack with Bert Ironmonger as your spinner. He was average at best - only 21 wickets in his 6 Ashes Tests, and it took him until he was almost 50 years old to make the team! I'd say your pace trio is the best of anyone's, although I don't think Samuels is far behind. Lillee is awesome, Barnes is good, but not as good vs Australia as he was vs South Africa. Lohmann's average is great, but hard to put into context when everyone averaged below 20 in his day.

Batting wise...Border was a champ vs England. Boycott and Boon were great too. Cowper, not impressed - he only really played 1 good innings in his 2 series. Paynter has great stats, but that's all - he wasn't good enough to be in the England side most of his career. Simpson is good, underrated guy these days.

Not sure how you got Wayne Phillips Should have definitely gone Rod Marsh, much more influential player even if his average was a couple of points lower.

Pretty good overall, I think if you'd improved Ironmonger, Cowper and Phillips it would be up there with the better ones!

 

[Aalay]

Pretty good overall, I think if you'd improved Ironmonger, Cowper and Phillips it would be up there with Aalay's side!

Fixed it for you!

 

[Sulaiman7]

Not sure how you got Wayne Phillips Should have definitely gone Rod Marsh, much more influential player even if his average was a couple of points lower.!

I forgot about him!

 

[War]

This is good A few people are at least 1 or 2 players behind...I've made it a bit harder by picking 2 players at once. Looking forward to your insights on your players Looking at that team, I quite like the mix of players you've got, despite having no 'superstar'. Good balance of bowlers, plenty of attacking batsmen.

Yea Sifter i did my write-ups and pics as promised.

 

[John Wardle]

Re Johnny Wardle

It was great to see my father mentioned again. Thank goodness his memory is kept alive by such stalwarts as Rob Steen. With reference to Lock's suspect action it seems that the authorities actually discouraged the umpires from calling him. Len Hutton certainly thought he could be a major influence in beating Australia and this may have been paramount. Naturally I am biased but I think this was a scandal that has never been fully explored.
not only did Lock keep my father out of the England team, peter May wrote that he would have played almost every Test had their careers not coincided, but he was also the most effective bowler in an all international Surrey attack whose seven continuous Championships deprived a fine Yorkshire side from doing so on at least three occasions. They were deemed to have failed although the points they gathered would have won the Championship in many other years. This "failure" caused great distress in Yorkshire and my father, not entirely innocent, was released in his prime for being a disruptive influence. His angry reaction, writing critical articles, led to him being de-selected from the Australian tour. england lost 4-0 but I have a quote from Richie Benaud saying that "he could well have won the Ashes for England had he not been banned". Quite a stretch but a glance at what each of these bowlers did in South Africa in the previous two winters and at what Wardle did in Sydney in 55 gives food for thought.
My father generally bowled orthodox finger spin in England and wrist spin abroad and averaged just over 20 in both styles. Rob Brydon pointed out that he figures highly in average, 1st. economy rate, 3rd. of all bowlers taking 100 Test wickets since the First World War. He is and about 5th. for strike rate of spinners in spite of the fact that Lock was usually preferred on spinning wickets in England.
at the beginning of 56, when Bob Appleyard, because of his dual styles, considered him the most dangerous bowler in the country, his figures were better than both Lock and Laker and yet he played in only teo more home Tests, both at Lord's then more helpful to seamers.
Alan Hill divided Lock's career into three phases; pre 52 before he used his new action when he averaged 23 per wicket; 52-58/9 (the very seven years of Surrey's Championships0 when he averaged 14.78 and post 59 when he reverted to an acceptable action when he averaged 23 again. in Tests it is even more astonishing as his average of 14.9 in England between 52 and 58 became 48.06 post 59. my father's average in First-class cricket was 18.95 and in Tests 20.39. Any wonder that he was aggrieved?
Had he been treated fairly I am convinced he would have taked around 300 Test wickets, about par for the course these days, and been remembered more frequently and more favourably.
Nevertheless I thank you for your interest.

Johnny Wardle

Unless his elbow causing him to quit soon, Graeme Swann will overtake Derek Underwood as the leading England slow bowler of all time & maybe when he retires he will be rated as the greatest too. This will be notable achievement especially for an english off-spinner and art ENG have struggled to produce with much top bowlers except for Jim Laker & Ray Illingworth.

Left-arm spin is ENG main spin forte as leg-spin is to Australia. Blyte, Briggs, Verity, Lock, Underwood. But one specific left-arm spinner who was basically ahead of times & probably will forever go unmentioned as times passes is Johnny Wardle.

As distinguished English cricket writer Rob Steen mentioned in an article about him Johnny Wardle and the importance of being memorable | Opinion | Cricinfo Magazine | ESPN Cricinfo - "he was maverick in less tolerant times, when conformity was all and daring to be different was not a marketable commodity. With his unique ability to bowl left-arm orthodox & chinaman with equally skill - its not a stress to say he was the most skilled English spinner ever.

It always has puzzled me how in those days if the cricket authorities could bann aussies Ian Mekiff, Gordon Rorke, S Africa's Geoff Griffin & Kiwi Gary Bartlett for chucking - but allowed Lock to get away with chucking for almost two decades. Because essentially while Laker was # 1 - Lock kept Wardle from playing more Ashes other tests in for England.

If Wardle had played from the 70s onwards it is indeed possible Underwood would not have had a career & in modern times when Warne/Murali ran rampant & off-spinners bowling the doosra, he would have been celebrated for his skills as a spinner.

 

[War]

Wow well if you are indeed Johnny Wardle's son - big welcome to planetcricket then.

For a good few years i've been always fascinated about Wardle & what his career could have been if he was given a fair chance during his time or was born in recent times.