Selectors

[dezzagod]

I was reading an article today about Jamie Cox. For those who don't know Jamie Cox was a Tasmanian bastaman who should have played for Australia but never got his chance. When everyone thought he would be picked...he wasn't. As a result he fought hard to become an Australian selector after he retired from First Class cricket (hopefully he will make things right).

This got me to thinking. Are players getting the chance they deserve. OK I know the Autralian side is like the hardest side in the world to get in to, but during this time Martyn & Langer were in form slumps but nothing changed.

Elliot had his chance...failed and got dropped
Di Venuto had his chance...failed and got dropped
Clarke failed...got dropped...fought his way back in

Don't get me wrong. I know you can only use 11 players at a time, and you can't just give everyone a shot, but if someone is performing so well and others are not performing shouldn't they be replaced.

Jamie Cox Stats
First Class
Matches: 264
Innings: 467
NO: 31
Runs: 18614
Highest Score: 250
Average: 42.69
100: 51
50: 81
Catches: 124

Cox is just an example. I am sure there are many more that have just plainly been overlooked.

 

[Kev]

Its an age old problem, that doesnt just exist in cricket. There are lots of things that need to be considered not just stats alone.

There's the balance of the team and the fact chopping and changing upsets that, lets face it the old phrase "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" has a lot of truth about it.

Also there's personal attitude, how you think the player will deal on the bigger stage, how he will get along with other team members and lots of other reasons.

Some players just dont make it even though their stats suggest they should whereas others will break through with poorer stats and still others will get in the team and not cut it. At the end of the day someone has to pick a side and someone is going to be left out.

 

[manee]

Graeme Hick is a prime example of someone dominating in county but not quite making it internationally.

 

[MUFC1987]

Great bloke Cox. Best Australian batsman in English Cricket in the last 10 years in my opinion. Consistently carried Somerset which was good of him, when we needed it. I think if he played for a more fashionable State side he would have played Test Cricket to be honest.

Graeme Hick is a prime example of someone dominating in county but not quite making it internationally.

Yeah, but that's because he was poor when given a chance. Not being given a go is a different kettle of fish so to speak.

 

[ZoraxDoom]

There are so many things to consider. As Kev said, the balance of the team, the way a player will get along, and his attitude. Also their will, do they want to play test cricket, play at the highest level, or are they happy at domestic level. Can they stomach the pressure, the hard work and preperation, all the travelling, or will it be too much? Are they willing to dedicate time and effort, to focus on one task, or not? Lots of factors. Their temperment, technique, determination and stuff. Even if a batsman has one slight flaw, it will be exposed cruelly at international level.

 

[woodywiss sa sa]

Example of this being that It nearly Happened To Hussey, Imagine, Cox Could have had a similar impact

 

[brad352]

but during this time Martyn & Langer were in form slumps but nothing changed.

And in hindsight this would prove to be a good decision

Elliot had his chance...failed and got dropped
Di Venuto had his chance...failed and got dropped

Both players were making more runs than Cox in domestic cricket, were they undeserving of a chance?

but if someone is performing so well and others are not performing shouldn't they be replaced.

And as in the examples above, they were- apart from JL and Marto who the selectors correctly identified as players that would come good

Jamie Cox Stats
First Class
Matches: 264
Innings: 467
NO: 31
Runs: 18614
Highest Score: 250
Average: 42.69
100: 51
50: 81
Catches: 124

Solid but not outstanding, he wasn't scoring the amount of runs to make himself impossible not to pick- to say he's been overlooked isn't completely accurate, he would be in the selectors minds but there were better performed players which were more highly rated by selectors for whatever reasons. He was a victim of a ridiculously strong era of Australian cricket, not selection policies.

FWIW, career Sheffield Shield/Pura Cup averages (to get rid of the county inflation) of players that were in and around the team:

Name                Mat    I  NO  Runs   HS     Ave 100  50   Ct St Team
RT Ponting           48   89  13  4756  233   [b]62.57[/b]  20  14   32  - TAS
JL Langer            90  163  12  7983  274*  [b]52.86[/b]  24  30   74  - WA
ME Waugh             93  158  18  7232  229*  [b]51.65[/b]  23  30  112  - NSW
MTG Elliott         107  205  17  9641  203   [b]51.28[/b]  32  44  132  - VIC/SOA
SR Waugh             85  147  14  6609  216*  [b]49.69[/b]  22  24   83  - NSW
ML Love             121  212  18  8791  300*  [b]45.31[/b]  22  37  138  - QLD
DR Martyn            96  169  16  6847  203*  [b]44.75[/b]  20  34   91  1 WA
JD Siddons          146  259  21 10643  245   [b]44.71[/b]  30  50  189  - VIC/SOA
MA Taylor            85  147   3  6090  199   [b]42.29[/b]  15  34  120  - NSW
MJ Di Venuto        119  211   8  8066  189   [b]39.73[/b]  13  57  123  - TAS
J Cox               161  295  17 10821  245   [b]38.92[/b]  30  47   78  - TAS

 

[cricketmad09]

I reakon Cox would have failed if he every played test cricket. He is a Blewett, Di Venuto, Elliot type that is solid at first class, but just not good enough to be a solid test player.

 

[symonds_sixes]

yeah an avg of 42 at state level isn't exactly outstanding

 

[aussie1st]

Hes got a similar FC average to Di Venuto and Di Venuto test match figures aren't too great. If anyone should be considered unlucky then Martin Love and Brad Hodge are two guys. Both have a very good averages in Test cricket.

 

[Iron-Haggis]

Example of this being that It nearly Happened To Hussey, Imagine, Cox Could have had a similar impact

Have a look at Hussey's Aussie stats and it tells the story of why Hussey was only recently picked by Australia. Australia do not pick players based on county form, they pick players based on state form. Exactly the same story with Jamie Cox, he was a solid player at state level but never anything special. Di Venuto never played Test cricket, so of course he didn't have good Test figures.

 

[MUFC1987]

This 'inflation from county cricket' that sees most players averages go down, is a good one. Anyway, all this BS about State records and what not and this guy played 74 Tests: http://content-uk.cricinfo.com/australia/content/player/7629.html

Someone explain that to me.

 

[ZoraxDoom]

Because he raised his game in important occassions. Slats had a higher Test than FC average. He was also one of the first of a line of destructive Aussie batsmen and one of the early destructive openers before Haydo, Viru, Gayle, Tresco and he such. He had the attitude and temperment to hack it at the higher level, although many say he didn't do justice to his talent.
I am too confused why Hussey didn't play earlier, but you have to understand. For the Aussies, stats aren't everything, if anything, to select players by. They would have to average in like the high 50s for 5 or 6 seasons continually until his stats are considered.

 

[aussie1st]

It's all about having the right form at the right time. You can have awesome FC stats like a 60 average but if you have a major form slump when there is an opening the selectors will have doubts over you.

Slater had a golden start to his career given he made his FC debut in 91 and then Australian debut in 93 to go along with the fact he was in the NSW 2nd 11 at the start of the 92/93 season.

 

[Iron-Haggis]

I am too confused why Hussey didn't play earlier, but you have to understand. For the Aussies, stats aren't everything, if anything, to select players by. They would have to average in like the high 50s for 5 or 6 seasons continually until his stats are considered.

Hussey didn't get picked because 2000-01 season he averaged 30. In 01-02 he averaged 35 and in 02-03 he averaged 34. Then he started to improve in Australia averaging 41 in 03-04 and then 55 in 04-05. Funnily enough straight after improving his State form he gets picked.

You should also dig a little deeper for Michael Slater. After his last Test his First Class form was woeful and he even got dropped from NSW. Plus when you look at First Class statistics you should always take into consideration their form when they first play. Because young players in State cricket are picked on potential for quite a bit and some players take a while to really fulfill that potential. Michael Clarke will be a good example, he has a low First Class average because he got picked for the ODI side young and hasn't really gotten too many oppurtunities to play First Class cricket since, plus he struggled in County cricket.