DBC 14 batting, my favourite stuff
- Thread starter T.J.Hooker
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T.J.Hooker
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^^^ exactly. I spent paragraphs explaining exactly what my mistakes were, why I made them and why the run out felt like a fair and "good" result, and how closely it tallies with my experiences from real cricket and how overall this fits into the framework of risk / reward and consequences for mistakes that make batting in DBC seem worthwhile and fun.
blockerdave
ICC Chairman
The thread starter derailed it!
T.J.Hooker
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Well I derailed it slightly from "my favourite stuff" to "times when you can steal runs from the ai" but resisted a further derail into completely incoherent bollocks.
blockerdave
ICC Chairman
says the person who once asked for an on-the-fly ethnicity switch button... okaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay.
FWIW, i don't think Dakota was trying to derail anything, or being incoherent. doesn't mean he was entirely correct, but i think he was posting in good faith and deserved a better response.
T.J.Hooker
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Ok well if I've failed the Blockerdave courtesy test then I guess I should probably think twice about my conduct.
To take the issue of why you'd want to hear a something negative if you run out a senior partner, the only thing I can suggest is that Dakota should try running out a professional batsman with a bad call in a serious game and see what the reaction is. A curmudgeonly Aussie pro would probably be the ideal choice.
I think the on-field chat really works in Pro Cam, but there's a lot of stuff that's par for the course in serious cricket that I miss, the same way I miss taking guard. Hearing the captain give orders, getting specific sledges or comments on your shots from the bowler / keeper / slips / short leg, for instance. But clearly there's a limit to how much you can cram in there. It needs to be stuff that makes sense in terms of the DBC game mechanic, and if you're actually going to interrupt the game with something like a mid pitch conference, it needs to be something that serves a definite purpose and that responds meaningfully to user input.
Bad calling is probably the most urgent situation where you need a mid-pitch conference in a real game, and it translates quite well to DBC because you have full control over your calls and you have the opportunity of making very bad or very good ones, and the process of deciding on taking a run is very close to real cricket - with the caveat that your partner will happily run on anything, no matter how suicidal, and running him out with a terrible call doesn't seem like a big deal. Fostering the illusion that your partner is a real person who doesn't want to be run out has surely got to be a plus for the game in terms of immersion in career mode, if for no other reason that the more real all the ai players seem, the more real the game seems and the more meaningful your achievements seem.
I love the current on field chat for exactly that reason. The oohs and aahs when the spinners are on remind me so much of real batting. It's ace. I would love to have a bit more of it. I'd love to see the illusion that they're really responding to my in-game actions strengthened. Even better if they can respond to patterns in my play over numerous games, in the way that real fielders behave differently depending on the reputation of the batsman.
With the current engine, on the other hand, a conference about what's happening with the pitch or the bowling is more of a window dressing idea, because the ai doesn't really seem to work to bowling plans or have the kind of variation between different bowlers or pitches that would make that sort of advice meaningful and useful in an in game context. And the interaction with different types of ball movement is fairly minimal, because, in contrast to the continuous nature of real batting responses, you've completed your shot input before the movement actually happens in DBC, and as I mentioned earlier in the thread the really important factor in real life batting - working out the interception point and having to precisely coordinate the bat to reach that location - isn't simulated. You make a very generalised judgement about the delivery, and the game gives you quite a lot of leeway with shot choice / execution to avoid it being impossibly hard.
If, however, the batting system improves in terms of being able to exercise finer / later judgement in responding to movement, and there's a really definite sense of different bowlers having particular delivery repertoires, unique delivery characteristics and proper bowling plans, then ambient chat from your partner about batting conditions and bowling plans would be an ace idea, and I'm all for it.
And in a situation where, lets say, you're a bowler batting with a senior player and he wants the strike, a quick word in your ear to look for the one just makes so much sense, and it needn't interrupt the game at all to achieve it. The game benefits from the user explicitly knowing the tactical situation and intentions and chat from the guy at the other end would be so much more naturalistic then a hud message.
To take the issue of why you'd want to hear a something negative if you run out a senior partner, the only thing I can suggest is that Dakota should try running out a professional batsman with a bad call in a serious game and see what the reaction is. A curmudgeonly Aussie pro would probably be the ideal choice.
I think the on-field chat really works in Pro Cam, but there's a lot of stuff that's par for the course in serious cricket that I miss, the same way I miss taking guard. Hearing the captain give orders, getting specific sledges or comments on your shots from the bowler / keeper / slips / short leg, for instance. But clearly there's a limit to how much you can cram in there. It needs to be stuff that makes sense in terms of the DBC game mechanic, and if you're actually going to interrupt the game with something like a mid pitch conference, it needs to be something that serves a definite purpose and that responds meaningfully to user input.
Bad calling is probably the most urgent situation where you need a mid-pitch conference in a real game, and it translates quite well to DBC because you have full control over your calls and you have the opportunity of making very bad or very good ones, and the process of deciding on taking a run is very close to real cricket - with the caveat that your partner will happily run on anything, no matter how suicidal, and running him out with a terrible call doesn't seem like a big deal. Fostering the illusion that your partner is a real person who doesn't want to be run out has surely got to be a plus for the game in terms of immersion in career mode, if for no other reason that the more real all the ai players seem, the more real the game seems and the more meaningful your achievements seem.
I love the current on field chat for exactly that reason. The oohs and aahs when the spinners are on remind me so much of real batting. It's ace. I would love to have a bit more of it. I'd love to see the illusion that they're really responding to my in-game actions strengthened. Even better if they can respond to patterns in my play over numerous games, in the way that real fielders behave differently depending on the reputation of the batsman.
With the current engine, on the other hand, a conference about what's happening with the pitch or the bowling is more of a window dressing idea, because the ai doesn't really seem to work to bowling plans or have the kind of variation between different bowlers or pitches that would make that sort of advice meaningful and useful in an in game context. And the interaction with different types of ball movement is fairly minimal, because, in contrast to the continuous nature of real batting responses, you've completed your shot input before the movement actually happens in DBC, and as I mentioned earlier in the thread the really important factor in real life batting - working out the interception point and having to precisely coordinate the bat to reach that location - isn't simulated. You make a very generalised judgement about the delivery, and the game gives you quite a lot of leeway with shot choice / execution to avoid it being impossibly hard.
If, however, the batting system improves in terms of being able to exercise finer / later judgement in responding to movement, and there's a really definite sense of different bowlers having particular delivery repertoires, unique delivery characteristics and proper bowling plans, then ambient chat from your partner about batting conditions and bowling plans would be an ace idea, and I'm all for it.
And in a situation where, lets say, you're a bowler batting with a senior player and he wants the strike, a quick word in your ear to look for the one just makes so much sense, and it needn't interrupt the game at all to achieve it. The game benefits from the user explicitly knowing the tactical situation and intentions and chat from the guy at the other end would be so much more naturalistic then a hud message.
D
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T.J.Hooker
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I have been called some interesting names by a couple of Aussie test players, but not him.
D
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Well people need a reason to call you a name is all I can really add to that. Though if a test cricketer was to play club cricket I’m am sure they wouldn’t expect the same standards they would encounter in international cricket.
T.J.Hooker
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Depends on the player, and whether or not they're from Australia. They expect you to know what you're doing if you're playing senior cricket, and if you mess up in a way that costs the team or (even worse) them personally they are not usually shy about telling you. The biggest earfuls I ever got were from test players in club cricket when I was 16 /17.
DBC is trying to do a pro cricket experience, and you have the freedom to make really awful calls. If you make really awful calls and run a senior player out in a pro game you are absolutely certain to make them incredibly cross, and you are pretty likely to hear something from them if you are anywhere near their path back to the pavilion.
In this clip of Botham running out Boycott in 78, you can see Boycs walking over to have a word with Botham before he turns to go. You can be fairly sure it wasn't anything complimentary, and he refused to talk to Botham at all for the rest of the series, which was extra awkward because Boycott was captain. Botham had to ask for field changes by relaying messages through other players.
That's just what a really bad run out in pro cricket looks like.
Run outs can also be great comedy moments if the tail or some famously terrible runner is batting. Would love to see a bit of that flavour coming through as well, although it's more difficult to imagine how that might happen.
DBC is trying to do a pro cricket experience, and you have the freedom to make really awful calls. If you make really awful calls and run a senior player out in a pro game you are absolutely certain to make them incredibly cross, and you are pretty likely to hear something from them if you are anywhere near their path back to the pavilion.
In this clip of Botham running out Boycott in 78, you can see Boycs walking over to have a word with Botham before he turns to go. You can be fairly sure it wasn't anything complimentary, and he refused to talk to Botham at all for the rest of the series, which was extra awkward because Boycott was captain. Botham had to ask for field changes by relaying messages through other players.
That's just what a really bad run out in pro cricket looks like.
Run outs can also be great comedy moments if the tail or some famously terrible runner is batting. Would love to see a bit of that flavour coming through as well, although it's more difficult to imagine how that might happen.
which can be a misjudged run maybe ?
In DBC we play as Pro cricketers, fwiw this will happen in all games from club to INTL level in real life, any batmsan will be pissed of at being runout by the partner only the levels of showing it off will vary depending on personality!
Even someone as cool as MSD can get angry when there is bad calls in running in an important match this was in WC final and this wasnt even a runout just a bad call! you can literally cite thousands of examples of batsman grumbling at their partners regarding running!
D
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If you read his reply it cleared the majority of it up and explained more or less everything you needed to know.
It did leave me wanting to ask him two questions but if anything I am a little sick of talking about the run out subject. I am not saying that in a bitter way it’s just how many ways can you go around in circles which will come back to the resulting personality of the batsman that runs the other out or the batsman that has been ran out.
Depends on his character and how he reacts to the situation. Well I suppose the factors of that lay in the actual run out when it occurs some are really bad ones.
Could also depend on the decade when it happened and the people involved how people interacted socially what was acceptable and what was not. (hope this didn’t happen yesterday TJ)
One thing to clear up was that I was not trying to make out that TJ was a bad guy it’s just he said a few had called him names and I wanted to understand why this was case.
Case closed can we have a subject change otherwise the thread is “my favourite run outs the extended cut” it’s not funny but there is more to cricket.
blockerdave
ICC Chairman
The main thing is TJ got to tell us about his extensive real life experience. I'm surprised he's not mentioned it before.
