puddleduck
Chairman of Selectors
My Dad could beat your Dad in fisticuffs
that doesnt change the fact Ponting averages 65.68 as captain...ZoraxDoom said:Punter is a crap captain. A blind dog could lead Australia and get similar results.
And yes, Legends should only be those who have retired...
Not necessarily. Warne was a legend before he retired. So is Tendulkar and Lara. They've played the game for enough time and have shown the world what they've done. I have no doubt that even if Lara or Tendulkar fail from now they'll go down as legends.ZoraxDoom said:Punter is a crap captain. A blind dog could lead Australia and get similar results.
And yes, Legends should only be those who have retired...
The same way Tendulkar can't play McGrath or Pollock without losing his wicket? Tendulkar was never successful in South Africa either. He was another one of Donald's bunnies.Amit89 said:Tendulkar as faced the new ball all his life, I cannot see how you can see Tendulkar as a flat track bully when he as scored runs all over the world, correct me if I am wrong, but he has scored 4 100s in Aus, 3 in Sa and 3 in Eng all agaisnt good bowling attacks, and tough conditions.
All great players have played great bowlers good, Ponting as failed against Wasim, Waqur and Donald, I'm not sure how he would have performed agaisnt his own bowling of Warne and Mcgrath. Ponting only averages 12.28 in India, he as struggled agaisnt spin in India, and a average like the is crazy. Tendulkar had to play good bowling on tough pitches for him when he just started playing intertional cricket. Remember those 2 100s agaisnt Australia?, ecspecially the one at Perth?, that was only his 3rd year of cricket and his first tour to Australia.
People expect too much from Tendulkar, in the late 90s people in India would expect a 100 from him in evrey match, even when Tendulkar scored a 100, India often lost the match, you dont know half of it, when Tendulkar failed in the 2003 world cup final people in India wanted him to retire despite of him scoring heavy in the world cup the games before leading to the final, Tendulkar as had to face the most pressure as a cricketer then any other cricketer alive, he as to drive his ferrari in the night.
As for captaincy, Tendulkar failed, but he had to captain a very weak team, and he needed to mature a bit, he captained India a bit early. Australia are a very, very strong side, any crap captain could captain Australia.
The show would lose its credibility if they did that.gambino said:have they done a shahid afridi episode?
you say that then Tendulkar and Lara's performances in the last few years should be similarily freakish...but they arent.....Ponting..especially in Test cricket sometimes just never looks like he will get out and seeing as 7 out of the last 10 series he has played in he averages over 70, thats a fair bit different to over 60 and is freakish against any attack internationally....he is suspect against spin early on, but most batsmen are, no one plays short bowling or very quick bowling better...he has been very successful against the likes of Ntini, Shoaib, Harmison, and is also more than good against Murali and the likeCricket_god said:Tendulkar at his prime was averaging above 60 and was good on all surfaces
and against the bowlers who were better than todays by a fair margin.Bradman knows a bit about cricket when he commented about tendulkar.I agree ponting is better than tendulkar on bouncy and flat tracks
but when it comes to low and slow tracks and playing spin he is nowhere near tendulkar and lara.his game is such so thats the price he has to pay to be very good on tracks with even bouce and no lateral movement.he is good
but not better than tendulkar or lara even in his prime also he did not face warne
wfdu_ben91 said:Bradman never saw Ponting in his prime though and Ponting has improved leaps and bounds against spin bowling over the last few years that it's no longer a weakness but a strength for him when facing.
I think Ponting averaging in the mid 70s these days makes up for Ponting averaging around 60 back then aswell.
Tendulkar at his prime didn't produce results anywhere near Ponting's prime even if you take into account the bowling attacks.
Back then Ponting was going through a rough patch in his life though. Compared to Sachin's Sachin's pressure is nothing.Cricket_god said:Results have to given by a team not a player Australian team was so good that pontings runs always ended in wins.he was not averaging 60 he was in the mid 40 when those great fast bowlers were there.He still struggles big time aginst spin in low slow tracks as you have seen in malaysia and in india
he is good against fast bowlers.but he has to prove himself aginst spinners.
he was younger...he matured as a batsman...your weakness against spin arguement would hold credibility if he averaged 2-5 more than Lara and Tendulkar ....but it isnt that...he averages about 25 more than Tendulkar in the last 5 years and about 13 more than Lara....and over the last 4 years in Australia he has averaged 88 with the bat....if you think nuffie attacks are the cause then why is Tendulkar and Lara simply outclassed.....Ponting by the end of his career will be ahead of both by a considerable margin in terms of runs scored and centuries made based on the last few years.Cricket_god said:Results have to given by a team not a player Australian team was so good that pontings runs always ended in wins.he was not averaging 60 he was in the mid 40 when those great fast bowlers were there.He still struggles big time aginst spin in low slow tracks as you have seen in malaysia and in india
he is good against fast bowlers.but he has to prove himself aginst spinners.
stereotype said:he was younger...he matured as a batsman...your weakness against spin arguement would hold credibility if he averaged 2-5 more than Lara and Tendulkar ....but it isnt that...he averages about 25 more than Tendulkar in the last 5 years and about 13 more than Lara....and over the last 4 years in Australia he has averaged 88 with the bat....if you think nuffie attacks are the cause then why is Tendulkar and Lara simply outclassed.....Ponting by the end of his career will be ahead of both by a considerable margin in terms of runs scored and centuries made based on the last few years.
since this increase in form by Ponting he has had limited opportunities in India as a Test match batsman BUT he still easily scores runs in India in ODI's
You say he struggles against spin but in Sri Lanka he averages 54 over the course of his career against now the best spin bowler in the world
also averages 37.34 in India in ODI's
wfdu_ben91 said:Back then Ponting was going through a rough patch in his life though. Compared to Sachin's Sachin's pressure is nothing.
He doesn't struggle against spin! He had one bad series against Harbhajan in 2001 and that was 6 years ago!
Apparently Ponting doesn't struggle in the subcontient. He actually averages 40 odd.
He struggles in india not in pakistan where they murder bowling.You might say he has improved a lot and now he has matured and wil play spin well and also score heavly on low slow tracks but till he does it in reality .wait for the world cup in west indies we may get our answers.
Cricket_god said:He averages 3 more than tendulkar overall .He has 8 tests in india if that is limited opportunity then i agree with you.Every batsman has a peak then he goes downhill so do not jump the gun yet he might still be behind tendulkar lara.
wfdu_ben91 said:Back then Ponting was going through a rough patch in his life though. Compared to Sachin's Sachin's pressure is nothing.
He doesn't struggle against spin! He had one bad series against Harbhajan in 2001 and that was 6 years ago!
Apparently Ponting doesn't struggle in the subcontient. He actually averages 40 odd.
He struggles in india not in pakistan where they murder bowling.You might say he has improved a lot and now he has matured and wil play spin well and also score heavly on low slow tracks but till he does it in reality .wait for the world cup in west indies we may get our answers.
And do not say he is under the same pressure as sachin he plays freely as he
had such agood team where as sachin for most of his career had to play almost a lone hand and he has faced all the great bowlers
Pontings second half of his career he has averaged 72....thats better form than Tendulkar has ever been in....and your arguement of the lack of world class bowlers helping Ponting isnt really consistant because of the fact Tendulkar has not had a similar increase to his average...Cricket_god said:He averages 3 more than tendulkar overall .He has 8 tests in india with an average of 12 .if that is limited opportunity then i agree with you.Every batsman has a peak then he goes downhill so do not jump the gun yet he might still be behind tendulkar lara.
And do not say he is under the same pressure as sachin he plays freely as he
had such agood team where as sachin for most of his career had to play almost a lone hand and he has faced all the great bowlers
players like Rahul Dravid, Virender Sehwag, Saurav Ganguly? they are world class batsmen and hardly the make of a lone hand candidateCricket_god said:He averages 3 more than tendulkar overall .He has 8 tests in india with an average of 12 .if that is limited opportunity then i agree with you.Every batsman has a peak then he goes downhill so do not jump the gun yet he might still be behind tendulkar lara.
And do not say he is under the same pressure as sachin he plays freely as he
had such agood team where as sachin for most of his career had to play almost a lone hand and he has faced all the great bowlers