What is a fair expectation of game quality? (Voted best thread by Zim)

[BigAntStudios]

Our AI adapts and learns how you play and you won't get away with the same stuff for long, it will predict what you will do based on what you have done and suck you right in

I can tell you now that in terms of "all that and more" - not a chance - from what I've heard, and that's all anyone can go on, we have all that Ashes 201X has and more with regard to fielding. Even if I took out our semi-automatic and manual fielding their system would still be a mere subset of what we do.

Before someone kicks me for comparing the competitor directly, I would remind all that it started with the words "all that and more" as a direct comparison to our product, although I would note that since those words were uttered we have actually seen less than nothing.

 

[blockerdave]

that sounds excellent.

i know this isn't exactly the thread, but will the AI "reset" if for example I start a new career mode? or does it learn in every me v AI game regardless of the format?

 

[BigAntStudios]

It will restart for each Career as your attributes will likely change your style of play (playing to your strengths).

Casual matches will learn for that game and address the attack accordingly.

 

[cricket_online]

One of the best implementation of difficulty in the game I have seen is Madden. Essentially there are 3 ways you can set the difficulty level...

1. Choosing a generic setting like "Rookie", "Pro", "All Pro" or "All Madden" - This will set up appropriate pre-defined sliders in the game which allows for easy pick n play.

2. Choosing a Custom difficulty level - Using this option you select the sliders for various gameplay elements.

3. Adaptive/Automatic - In this scenario the game adjusts the difficulty level depending on how you play. So you may have pasing setting set to a high level (if you are a good passer), running the may ball setting may be set to low (if you are struggling to run the ball), passing defense can be medium and run defense set to very low. Every game you play is factored in and you always get a decent game.

Along with the difficulty levels the AI adjusts to you and picks up your tendencies, so if you go for a throw to the middle of the field or a dump off to the flats on 3rd downs expect the AI to jmp the route after a while. I understand the AI piece might be a bit difficult to get right in cricket but surely custom or adaptable difficulty levels can be implemented. I have played Madden for a no. of years and I can honestly say a Madden game can easily last you for a couple of years, i.e. it never gets old as you can always tweak the sliders or adjust the difficulty settings to get a good game against the AI. Longevity is one area cricket games really struggle in as the game gets old and predictable when you have mastered the timing. That's the reason AC09 was one of the best cricket game to date since ability to play online allowed you to come up against decent opposition helping with the longevity aspect.

Define various gameplay elements like Batting against pace, Batting against Spin, Pace Bowling, Spin Bowling and Fielding and allow us to tweak the same rather than go with a generic difficulty level across the board. I may be a good batsman but a poor bowler and forcing me to go for a generic "Hard" setting will only force me in auto-playing the bowling part and moving on to batting.

 

[Chief]

One of the best implementation of difficulty in the game I have seen is Madden. Essentially there are 3 ways you can set the difficulty level...

1. Choosing a generic setting like "Rookie", "Pro", "All Pro" or "All Madden" - This will set up appropriate pre-defined sliders in the game which allows for easy pick n play.

2. Choosing a Custom difficulty level - Using this option you select the sliders for various gameplay elements.

3. Adaptive/Automatic - In this scenario the game adjusts the difficulty level depending on how you play. So you may have pasing setting set to a high level (if you are a good passer), running the may ball setting may be set to low (if you are struggling to run the ball), passing defense can be medium and run defense set to very low. Every game you play is factored in and you always get a decent game.

Along with the difficulty levels the AI adjusts to you and picks up your tendencies, so if you go for a throw to the middle of the field or a dump off to the flats on 3rd downs expect the AI to jmp the route after a while. I understand the AI piece might be a bit difficult to get right in cricket but surely custom or adaptable difficulty levels can be implemented. I have played Madden for a no. of years and I can honestly say a Madden game can easily last you for a couple of years, i.e. it never gets old as you can always tweak the sliders or adjust the difficulty settings to get a good game against the AI. Longevity is one area cricket games really struggle in as the game gets old and predictable when you have mastered the timing. That's the reason AC09 was one of the best cricket game to date since ability to play online allowed you to come up against decent opposition helping with the longevity aspect.

Define various gameplay elements like Batting against pace, Batting against Spin, Pace Bowling, Spin Bowling and Fielding and allow us to tweak the same rather than go with a generic difficulty level across the board. I may be a good batsman but a poor bowler and forcing me to go for a generic "Hard" setting will only force me in auto-playing the bowling part and moving on to batting.

Great example. And in fact always HAS been great.

When I was a young guy I used to LOVE playing Madden (From memory, that one was on the Atari ST) despite only having a rudimentary grasp of the rules. As I grew more interested and started following it properly, I could take on more difficulty: I pretty much learned everything about NFL from watching the "Ask Madden" selection. To start with I had no clue WHY the particular plays were being suggested, but as I learned more I started to appreciate it.

This is EXACTLY the key challenge for me with making cricket games accessible to a more casual audience: can you find a way that they can be taught and make them feel like they are not being mollycoddled through the process, whilst at the same time not annoying those who DO already understand it...

 

[cricket_online]

Great example. And in fact always HAS been great.

When I was a young guy I used to LOVE playing Madden (From memory, that one was on the Atari ST) despite only having a rudimentary grasp of the rules. As I grew more interested and started following it properly, I could take on more difficulty: I pretty much learned everything about NFL from watching the "Ask Madden" selection. To start with I had no clue WHY the particular plays were being suggested, but as I learned more I started to appreciate it.

This is EXACTLY the key challenge for me with making cricket games accessible to a more casual audience: can you find a way that they can be taught and make them feel like they are not being mollycoddled through the process, whilst at the same time not annoying those who DO already understand it...

Madden is one of the few games which can be enjoyed by both casual and hard core gamers alike, and proves that it is possible to have a sports game which has something for everyone without antagonizing any set of fans. IMO this should be the way forward for cricket games and am eagerly waiting to see the approach followed by Big Ant in DBC.

 

[Chief]

Madden is one of the few games which can be enjoyed by both casual and hard core gamers alike, and proves that it is possible to have a sports game which has something for everyone without antagonizing any set of fans.

I think we were close with BLIC05 to capturing the casual fans.
With AC09 the Wii version, which had the "Captain's Advice" feature which helped to tell you what you should be doing, was really good for them. The platform lent itself to that audience though, and there wasn't a lot for the hardcore cricket fans.

I think IC10 is probably the closest we got to appealing equally to both.

 

[cricket_online]

I think we were close with BLIC05 to capturing the casual fans.
With AC09 the Wii version, which had the "Captain's Advice" feature which helped to tell you what you should be doing, was really good for them. The platform lent itself to that audience though, and there wasn't a lot for the hardcore cricket fans.

I think IC10 is probably the closest we got to appealing equally to both.

BLIC05 was a great game and I loved it. Facing a genuine fast bowler like Akhtar or Lee was difficult and bowling speed hasn't been accurately represented in the game since. The downside were too many slower balls and a very poor AI, especially while batting. Other than that I really thought we had a foundation of a great cricket game.

BLIC 2007 was a huge step backwards and AC09 again brought the franchise back on track. The online gameplay showed how great a cricket game could be if AI was decent enough, and it was a fun game to play online. I can't say the same for IC 2010 as it carried over bugs from AC09 (fielding & field settings, cut/pull off yorkers, over-powered lofted shots etc.) but added a game breaking one, especially for folks like me who loved online gameplay, with broken online gameplay.

To me BLIC 2005 along with 360 degree shot selection from AC09 and online gameplay would be pretty close to the perfect game.

 

[Chief]

To me BLIC 2005 along with 360 degree shot selection from AC09 and online gameplay would be pretty close to the perfect game.

The Wii version of AC09 was pretty much identical to BLIC05 with some extra stuff bolted on...
Well, being greedy I'd like the analogue power from IC10 and the Captain's advice feature in as well... As well as a tidy up of the graphics. But agree that would make a very nice little game indeed.

 

[Dutch]

The Wii version of AC09 was pretty much identical to BLIC05 with some extra stuff bolted on...
Well, being greedy I'd like the analogue power from IC10 and the Captain's advice feature in as well... As well as a tidy up of the graphics. But agree that would make a very nice little game indeed.

Well I would need to have the whole fielding side of things utterly revamped. That was pretty mediocre in both Ashes 09 and IC2010.....very mediocre indeed.

 

[cricket_online]

The Wii version of AC09 was pretty much identical to BLIC05 with some extra stuff bolted on...
Well, being greedy I'd like the analogue power from IC10 and the Captain's advice feature in as well... As well as a tidy up of the graphics. But agree that would make a very nice little game indeed.

You can always add other stuff once the core gameplay is nailed... the examples you mentioned would be part of the enhancements as the series progresses. Can't say much about AC09 Wii version as I played AC09 on PS3 and it was a pretty good game, especially the online gameplay.

I guess one of the main frustrations with cricket gaming over the years is that just as it looked we were about to get over the hump as far as getting a great cricket game is concerned, the next iteration dropped the ball. We have rarely had two back-to-back cricket games which took the franchise forward and hopefully Big Ant (DBC) & 505 Games/Trickstar (AC) will reverse the trend and we will have two successful franchises for the long haul.

 

[barmyarmy]

Well I would need to have the whole fielding side of things utterly revamped. That was pretty mediocre in both Ashes 09 and IC2010.....very mediocre indeed.

How about having it entirely automated?

 

[Dutch]

How about having it entirely automated?

Can they do that? Wow! Yeah, that would be a big step in the right direction.

 

[blockerdave]

Can't say much about AC09 Wii version

I played AC09 Wii Version, and didn't buy another computer game for 3 years.

(I was neither playing the game, nor in prison during the intervening period, just looking at the receipt and vowing to be more careful with my money in future.)

EDIT: Not strictly true, I did buy Football Manager in each of the intervening years.

 

[cricket_online]

I played AC09 Wii Version, and didn't buy another computer game for 3 years.

(I was neither playing the game, nor in prison during the intervening period, just looking at the receipt and vowing to be more careful with my money in future.)

I guess that says it all

I am assuming it was more due to Wii motion control gimmickry than the result of "BLIC05 meets AC09"