Pakistan's tour of England - August/September - 3 Tests/3 T20Is

[AsadRM]

My lineup for today
Give Naseem rest for one match at least.

#8 Mohammad Rizwan

Rizwan is absolutely useless at #8. If he is to be played, he needs to bat in top #4. or #3 for me, ideally. The same goes for Sarfaraz.

Zeeshan Ashraf could've had solved this issue, by opening with Babar and Haider at #3. But they didn't even pick him in a 29-man squad

Also, Naseem needs to be protected from excessive Cricket, at this point in time.

He should be gradually played in ODIs after 2022 T20 WC and be groomed for 2023 ODI WC. Musa Khan, Hasnain, etc should not make his absence felt in the time being.

 

[Bevab]

But the 439 wickets took a lot lesser matches than Anderson's 600. Not saying that Anderson was bad or anywhere close to being bad, infact he was a GOAT. But also on the other hand Steyn 's career was cut down due to injuries and those were actually mismanaged. So had it been managed in a better way Steyn was still very much in contention and probably be the greatest fast bowler of this generation and would be rated second to none. This isn't to say Anderson is bad. He is the best in his own way and is more lethal than Steyn when the ball is moving around. My personal opinion I would rate Steyn as the greatest fast bowler of this generation and Anderson and Broad would come close to him or even might be par with him. Anyways that's just my personal opinion.

I've rated Steyn as perhaps the greatest pacer in test cricket given how good he was on pitches that did not offer assistance at all. My point was not that Jimmy was better than Steyn (they serve two very different roles in any case so a comparison is not easy), it is that the former does not receive enough credit for how well he has played in the last ten years and survived when most bowlers have essentially broken down. I do not think Steyn was mismanaged to the extent Anderson was, Anderson's bowling action was frequently targeted and the man was at a genuine risk of never playing for England again with how his action was modified to be ineffectual and how it affected his fitness. Steyn's issues were more fitness related on the other hand like most other pacers in history.

Longevity as a whole seems terribly underrated and neglected when people talk about the best players as a lot focus on averages alone when the overall figures should also receive merit. This is something that I frequently see among the newer generation of fans too who look at the averages of players like Ponting and Tendulkar, compare them to Sanga and Kallis and conclude that the latter two are better or at least in the same class when anyone who has watched the former duo knows how easily they were a class above. It is easier to play longer than the average cricketer for a batsman too while it is remarkably tough for a bowler, let alone a pacer. While Jimmy does get some credit for it, it is merely limited to "he managed his fitness well, fair enough" when it ought to be "bloody 'ell, this bloke is miraculous for playing so well and still looking like he could improve and is truly a once in a generation bowler for playing so long, almost no other pacer could do this". I guess the presence of Broad, another pacer with a similar CV makes it difficult to rate Anderson that highly (just like the Ashwin and Jadeja debate for India). Will be interesting to see how history judges the two of them once they hang up their boots.

 

[Bevab]

My only problem is that this team has too many players of the same role. Hafeez, Iftikhar, Shadab, Khushdil and Imad are literally pretty much the same players.

I'll go with the following:

Babar Azam
Fakhar Zaman (deserves one last chance)
Haider Ali
Rizwan
Shadab
Hafeez
Iftikhar/Khushdil (I'd be slightly biased in Khushdil's favor)
Imad Wasim
Amir
Haris Rauf/ Hasnain/Wahab
Shaheen/Hasnain/Wahab

Solid batting till #8 and Amir can also hit a couple against spinners as well. Rizwan brings the luxury of quick singles and can play the accumulator role. Shadab should be backed at #5 or #6, courtesy his prowess with the bat in the PSL. Iftikhar/Khushdil can be given complete liberty to go aggressive from ball 1. Amir, Shaheen, Rauf/Wahab make an excellent pace attack too.

This team has 12 overs of pace as well as 12 overs of spin. So, this team should be easy for the captain to rotate.

However, I feel like the following is the team that Pakistan is going to go with:

Babar
Fakhar
Haider Ali
Hafeez
Rizwan/Sarfaraz
Shoaib Malik
Iftikhar/Imad
Shadab
Amir
Wahab
Shaheen

Why are Pakistan still rolling out ANY lineup with Hafeez and Malik, in a format that is supposed to be all about the youth?

 

[AsadRM]

Why are Pakistan still rolling out ANY lineup with Hafeez and Malik, in a format that is supposed to be all about the youth?

*10 Mysteries that only Misbah-ul-Haq and Babar Azam can solve*

 

[Bevab]

Rizwan is absolutely useless at #8. If he is to be played, he needs to bat in top #4. or #3 for me, ideally. The same goes for Sarfaraz.

Zeeshan Ashraf could've had solved this issue, by opening with Babar and Haider at #3. But they didn't even pick him in a 29-man squad

Also, Naseem needs to be protected from excessive Cricket, at this point in time.

He should be gradually played in ODIs after 2022 T20 WC and be groomed for 2023 ODI WC. Musa Khan, Hasnain, etc should not make his absence felt in the time being.

I guess @CerealKiller has Rizwan in exclusively as a specialist keeper given the lack of power hitting he has. Not the worst idea when you can afford to have a Shadab Khan in the playing XI to bat in the top six and bowl four overs.

I also know that it is blasphemy to invoke his name but is it... worth bringing back Kamran Akmal only for the T20Is with two T20 World Cups back to back given how prolific he is in the PSL? If Sarfaraz does not play and Rizwan does not do the job, I do not see any other alternative other than taking a chance on some of the untested rookies.

 

[AsadRM]

I guess @CerealKiller has Rizwan in exclusively as a specialist keeper given the lack of power hitting he has. Not the worst idea when you can afford to have a Shadab Khan in the playing XI to bat in the top six and bowl four overs.

Yeah, I realize that @CerealKiller had him as a specialist keeper but you would be wasting him at #8.

Let's say Pakistan is 6 down for 180 in the 19th over requiring 20 more to chase England's total down. Rizwan walks in, with Amir at the other end. And Pakistan would be destined to lose due to lack of his power-hitting which is an obligation for a batting spot like #8. He won't even clear 50 yards against Saqib Mahmood, Curran, etc. While Rizwan walking in at Pakistan 2 down for 30, with Adil Rashid or even the pacers bowling, would help Pakistan's cause with excellent running and quick singles and doubles.

The times have changed. Long gone are the days when keepers would be batting at #8, #9 or even #10. If Pakistan are to play either one of Sarfaraz or Rizwan (which they sure have to), he should bat in the top order without a shadow of a doubt.

 

[Bevab]

Yeah, I realize that @CerealKiller had him as a specialist keeper but you would be wasting him at #8.

Let's say Pakistan is 6 down for 180 in the 19th over requiring 20 more to chase England's total down. Rizwan walks in, with Amir at the other end. And Pakistan would be destined to lose due to lack of his power-hitting which is an obligation for a batting spot like #8. He won't even clear 50 yards against Saqib Mahmood, Curran, etc. While Rizwan walking in at Pakistan 2 down for 30, with Adil Rashid or even the pacers bowling, would help Pakistan's cause with excellent running and quick singles and doubles.

The times have changed. Long gone are the days when keepers would be batting at #8, #9 or even #10. If Pakistan are to play either one of Sarfaraz or Rizwan (which they sure have to), he should bat in the top order without a shadow of a doubt.

On the contrary, imagine a scenario where you are chasing a 200+ total and the required run-rate is above 10 normally. Now it has crept up beyond 11 and you lose your second wicket. Do you send Rizwan in or do you promote one of your sloggers? And in the case you do demote Rizwan, it is very easy to end up in a situation where Rizwan does eventually come to the crease with the RR being even worse.

I feel this scenario is a lot more likely than a situation where Rizwan walks in at 8 and has to slog to win as in that case the game is already lost to an extent. I'm not a fan of either scenario though which is why I wouldn't want Rizwan in the XI at all, someone who can just about play at a pace of run-a-ball without the ability to catch up later with a flurry of boundaries is of no tactical use with the bat in a modern T20.

 

[Salman.]

My lineup for today
Give Naseem and Shaheen a rest for one match at least. Fakhar is out of form, and Malik has been awful in England.

Haider Ali
Babar Azam
Mohammad Hafeez (no other option, smh)
Iftikhar Ahmed
Shadab Khan
Khushdil Shah
Imad Wasim
Mohammad Rizwan
Mohammad Amir
Haris Rauf
Mohammad Hasnain

Agree.
We have a decent batting lineup. There is a lot of pressure to play Sarfraz but it will cause unrest. We won't be needing the keeper's batting much with these batsmen so it's better that we go with a specialist keeper.
Still believe that Wahab and Shoaib could come in for Hasnain and Khushdil (knowing Misbah).

 

[Velocity]

One interesting thing about Anderson's much maligned away record is that his average is better in India than Zaheer Khan's average in India. And unlike the latter he was bowling to the Indian team.

Another way to look at his record is that since the ECB stopped mucking around with his bowling action and allowed him to play the way he was supposed to (2010 to be more precise), he has taken 452 wickets at a bowling average of 24 (The South African pace trio and Cummins are the only ones with a better record having played in 30 games). That in itself would make him a great bowler to stand the test of time. But prior to that he also averaged 34 with 148 wickets. And this was when he was mismanaged terribly. You essentially have an ATG career and a decent career prior to that combined in this fella. Someone like Steyn with whom he is often unfairly compared as evidence of a pacer with impact has 'only' 439 wickets in his entire career! That speaks of how incredible Anderson's achievement is and how much more praise he should be receiving globally.

I think it's fair to compare Anderson and Steyn in the regard that they've essentially had careers that have started around the same time. But I do agree with your other post saying that Anderson was managed well unlike Steyn, which provokes people to divert their attention to a "What if" Steyn had not been injured for so long. But it's also true that Anderson and Steyn had different roles within their lineup depending on where they played, Anderson played a defensive role to not give many runs and apply pressure on Indian batsmen in 2012, which allowed Swann and Panesar to attack from the other end. On the other hand, Steyn played a much more attacking role to conjure wickets out of those dustbowls with his pace. Clearly both bowlers outbowl each other in different areas, but they've got different skill sets and roles that sets them apart somewhat. Personally, I would pick Steyn over Anderson in an all time XI, but that isn't to undermine Anderson's efforts because 600 wickets is clearly no joke and he's had success abroad as well. Fair to say Anderson looked after his body well and that should be lauded for as well as a fast bowler.

 

[Velocity]

Rizwan is absolutely useless at #8. If he is to be played, he needs to bat in top #4. or #3 for me, ideally. The same goes for Sarfaraz.

Agreed, Rizwan looks like a very promising player. He should be given an decent run in the XI, looks like a very dynamic keeper batsman that looks better from the likes of Sarfraz. Pakistan will be going a step backwards if they pick Sarfraz. Better they give Rizwan a chance at 4 and give him some assurance on his place in the team, could help harness his attacking batting style Pak would much prefer in their T20 batting.

Also, why are Hafeez and Malik still around? It's high time that Pakistan utilize their PSL talent and give them a chance at the T20 level instead of going back to the old timers.

 

[AsadRM]

Why are Hafeez and Malik still around?

Babar Azam is a fan of having seniors in the squad to help him with his captaincy, and impart their knowledge and experience to the youngsters.

I'm not sure whether that's a good approach.

 

[CerealKiller]

Rizwan can't hit if his life depends on it. He has to play as a specialist keeper at 8. We have enough all-rounders in the top seven.

 

[AsadRM]

Rizwan can't hit if his life depends on it

Can't disagree with this, though.

Let's hope whatever Pakistan management opts for, its good for the team.

 

[Salman.]

Rizwan can't hit if his life depends on it. He has to play as a specialist keeper at 8. We have enough all-rounders in the top seven.

A bit harsh tbh. He's in the form of his life. If he is backed up, he'd do decent. Even in the last National T20 cup, he was great.

 

[Salman.]

Also I wouldn't rule out Shaheen tonight. He might not be rested considering he and Haris are the only bowlers who can bowl with the new ball.
(Don't mention Amir fgs)